Dead in a Blade Barrier, what happens to the stuff?

[Stalker0]

I'm interpreting it like this:

If a spell allows a save, then a magic item (even if unattended) gets a saving throw. Note that a magic item gets a save in this situation even though a mundane item would not.

That looks like the most reasonable interpretation given the context and the problems that arise otherwise. You are welcome to your own opinion.

Why do you think that the spell has to normally give a save, in order for the magic item to have one? The quote I give says that the only requirement for the magic item to get a save is its against a spell that could deal damage to the item. That's it. Do you have a passage that I've overlooked?


And sorry about the caps above guys, I'm not trying to start a fight, but that quotes been posted like 3 times and it seemed like everyone was ignoring it.

 

[Avatar28]

Another thing to keep in mind is that to allow a 6th level spell to prety much automatically destroy any magic item is rather unbalanced. Figure that even the mighty Mordenkainen's Disjunction, a *9TH level spell,* doesn't do that. It can make them permanently non-magical, but it's not destroyed.

 

[Stalker0]

Thank you everyone for your comments, it's been real helpful in the research.

So far, here's what I've come to the conclusion of:

The unattended magical items do get a saving throw at 2+(1/2 caster level) each round.

Blade Barrier is a magical attack (even though the effects are blades) So Sunder weapon does not apply to this.

Blade Barrier is practically unstoppable! Other than the usual Dispel Magic, Magic Resistance and Counterspell(s).

Bottom line, the sword and ring gets a +12 saving throw vs the Blade Barrier each round. If they fail, they are destroyed.

LT

I agree with all of that except for the very last point. If I remember correctly, the barrier was 1/2 ft off the ground? Wouldn't it be reasonable to say that the magic items fell below the disk only needing one saving throw?

I mean I guess in this situation it boils down to do you really want the magic items destroyed? You could be a harsh dm and use the logic to say the magic items are probably toast. Or you could be a lenient dm and say they are under teh disk or got knocked away from it. I think either interpretation would make sense to the players, so the question is now not how do you interprete the situation but what outcome do you want?

 

[Stalker0]

Another thing to keep in mind is that to allow a 6th level spell to prety much automatically destroy any magic item is rather unbalanced. Figure that even the mighty Mordenkainen's Disjunction, a *9TH level spell,* doesn't do that. It can make them permanently non-magical, but it's not destroyed.

I think avatar has a point. Else the BBEG could just put a blade barrier right on the edge of the ground, and call it his magic minser and toss all the hero's into destroying both their lives and their magic.

In Dnd, magic is more important than lives, it really is. Lives can be replensished fairly easily, esp at high levels. But magic can be very hard to get back or replace.

 

[Dingleberry]

Maybe I'm missing something, but where did the notion that anything would take damage from a blade barrier every round come from?

 

[Lord Thurham]

I agree with all of that except for the very last point. If I remember correctly, the barrier was 1/2 ft off the ground? Wouldn't it be reasonable to say that the magic items fell below the disk only needing one saving throw?

It was already determined that the Blade Barrier was placed on the ground. I do plan to allow a scatter diagram scenario each round. If the luck follows the player, hopefully the more powerful items will bounce around and eventually bounce out. With a +12 save bonus, I'm hopeful that we can get at least one of those items out. All part of a gaming night, eh? I do play that when a powerful magical item is broken, it explodes. So there are other factors since there are a couple characters nearby. Could end up losing half of the party(and the enemies) if this is not played out carefully. Perhaps some divine intervention?

LT

 

[Shard O'Glase]

Maybe I'm missing something, but where did the notion that anything would take damage from a blade barrier every round come from?

Because that's what generally happens with damaging spells with a duration. Unless the spell specifically states you take no damage past the 1st round your in the area of effect I'd say any damaging spell with a duration continues to cause damage.

 

[Lord Thurham]

Maybe I'm missing something, but where did the notion that anything would take damage from a blade barrier every round come from?

The spell covers the entire area of effect. It's not a wall (unless it is placed vertical which is not the case this time) or creatures within the blade barrier would not have taken damage if they didn't leave the area. If you got a encumbered Halfling that is trying to leave the area at 10' per round, he would take damage each round until he left, no saving throw! This also applies to those that are entering the Blade Barrier, if they can't get through it this round, they will take damage the next round also as they exit.

From the SRD

[
This spell creates a spinning disk of blades. These whirl around a central point, creating an immobile, circular barrier. Any creature passing through the blade barrier takes 1d6 points of slashing damage per caster level (maximum 20d6). The plane of rotation of the blades can be horizontal, vertical, or slanted.
Creatures within the blade barrier when it is invoked take the damage as well. They can negate the damage with a successful Reflex saving throw, provided they can and do physically leave the area of the blades by the shortest possible route. Once the barrier is in place, anything entering or passing through the blades automatically takes damage.
A blade barrier serves as one-half cover (+4 AC) for anyone beyond it.

 

[0-hr]

Why do you think that the spell has to normally give a save, in order for the magic item to have one?

I believe that if a spell does not allow a saving throw, then a saving throw is not allowed. To overrule that would take a very clear statement to the contrary - one which did not have inherent flaws and multiple likely interpretations.

Equipment is considered part of the character and is not harmed unless they roll a natural "1" on a Reflex saving throw. A person falling into a Blade Barrier gets no save and so cannot roll a natural "1" and so cannot have any of his or her equipment damaged.

If, on the other hand, you purposely threw an unattended item through the plane of a blade barrier, then it would take damage. There would be no save, because the spell does not allow saves for things that enter it's area once it is in place.

 

[Stalker0]

I believe that if a spell does not allow a saving throw, then a saving throw is not allowed. To overrule that would take a very clear statement to the contrary - one which did not have inherent flaws and multiple likely interpretations.

Equipment is considered part of the character and is not harmed unless they roll a natural "1" on a Reflex saving throw. A person falling into a Blade Barrier gets no save and so cannot roll a natural "1" and so cannot have any of his or her equipment damaged.

If, on the other hand, you purposely threw an unattended item through the plane of a blade barrier, then it would take damage. There would be no save, because the spell does not allow saves for things that enter it's area once it is in place.

The quote I gave is a very clear statement to the contrary. And I'm not interpreting it, I'm simply reading the statement.

But Ki has a point about the guy falling and normally equipment doesn't take damage. Did the guy die immediately from the fall? You could have it as he's being skewered his equipment gets tossed about out of the barrier.