Diagonal wonkiness scenarios

[Sir Sebastian Hardin]

I would argue that the mats and rules do not "break from the gameworld" because they are internally consistent every time. I agree that the gameworld breaks from the realworld. But inside the gameworld the rule is consistent and universally applied.

How many times do we have to say this?

It's not about it being BROKEN!!! I it's VERY likely that it is not broken, and I am sure it is consistent every time. Thats NOT the issue.

It's about believability, logic and intuition. Not rules-intuition: natural intuition. Like saying: that mini "A" is farther from square "B" (center of the enlarged fireball) than mini "C" but A gets hit, and C does not.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Like saying: that mini "A" is farther from square "B" (center of the enlarged fireball) than mini "C" but A gets hit, and C does not.

Mini A isn't farther from square B. You've labelled the line AB '7.07', but it should be labelled '5.00'.

-Hyp.

 

[HeinorNY]

How many times do we have to say this?

It's not about it being BROKEN!!! I it's VERY likely that it is not broken, and I am sure it is consistent every time. Thats NOT the issue.

It's about believability, logic and intuition. Not rules-intuition: natural intuition. Like saying: that mini "A" is farther from square "B" (center of the enlarged fireball) than mini "C" but A gets hit, and C does not.

Yes, this sucks. Another good example that shows how 1-1-1-1 makes the game looks goofy.
1-1-1-1 is really about making the game a little faster, a little easier, and a lot sillier.

 

[Paradox]

How many times do we have to say this?

It's not about it being BROKEN!!! I it's VERY likely that it is not broken, and I am sure it is consistent every time. Thats NOT the issue.

It's about believability, logic and intuition. Not rules-intuition: natural intuition. Like saying: that mini "A" is farther from square "B" (center of the enlarged fireball) than mini "C" but A gets hit, and C does not.

Not to be a jerk, but "C" is one square further than it should be. Using 1-1-1-1, clearly it would be IN the shaded area. 4e is counting squres, not inches.

 

[hong]

So far, what I've learned about 4E wonkiness is that square rooms are actually round rooms,

Square rooms are square rooms, plus or minus a margin of error.

fireballs are actually fireboxes,

Fireballs are fireballs, plus or minus a margin of error.

reptiles have breasts

Reptiles have breasts, yes. DEAR GOD ALMIGHTY, REPTILES HAVE BREASTS.

But note, no nipples!

and when you are tired you start to bleed,

Possibly from the ears, at the rate this is going.

but if you play chess, Civilization and WoW, there is no reason to feel odd about all that.

Indeed, because that way, you have more fun. Are we having fun yet?

 

[Will]

Paradox, do you understand the point?

Visually, C looks closer than A. By 1-1-1-1, A is closer than C.

That's a disconnect between map and intuition.

 

[Sir Sebastian Hardin]

Mini A isn't farther from square B. You've labelled the line AB '7.07', but it should be labelled '5.00'.

-Hyp.

I didn't label anything, I just used a Dimension Line in AutoCad. This precise program made the mesurement, not me.

I am not placing the minis as the Far Realm rules tell me. I'm placing them as logic tells me, as my intuition tells me, as my eyes tell me.

Here's another one: this time with a normal fireball. (firebox)

 

[Paradox]

Ah, thanks for clearing that up.

Nevermind then.

 

[keterys]

Ah. So... the robots with embedded autocad chips shouldn't play 4e?

Though, no... they'd probably be able to model 1 square = 1 square pretty easily. So it's only humans with embedded autocad chips that are a problem.

 

[hong]

It depends on whether that 5x5 room is drawn on the diagonals or not.

If not, a 5x5 room can contain 25 orcs. A 2-square burst -- which does in fact affect a 5x5 area -- targeting the center of the room will affect all of them.

If the room is drawn on the diagonals, the 5x5 room can contain over 40 orcs. And a 2-square burst -- which affects a 5x5 area -- targeting the center of the room will only affect 25 of them.

Because of 1-1-1-1 diagonals, a room that is drawn on the diagonals is fully twice as large as a room drawn orthogonally, and a spell area that affects a 5x5 square area is a different size than a 5x5 square room.

This has nothing to do with how you measure diagonals.