Disarm, why so easy?

[Darklone]

Monk vs. Wizard: Surely he's supposed to disarm or grapple or stun. It's the monks strong point vs. the wizzies weak point. Did the monk ever try to disarm the greatswordwielding barbarian? No? So I'd be happy with it ... and my wizard evil overmind dudes have bodyguard fighters who try to keep monkies away.... or rip them to handy pieces if they don't stay away.

 

[Corsair]

Some items might be neither poorly secured, nor well secured, meaning no penalty NOR a bonus.

 

[Artoomis]

Some items might be neither poorly secured, nor well secured, meaning no penalty NOR a bonus.

That's number 2 above - -4 penalty for not being a weapon.

 

[Stalker0]

As far as I'm concerned, a disarming monk is crap in general. All improved disarm does is make sure they don't have a penalty. Now throw on the medium BAB. Now throw on the fact that fighters will have magic weapons that give them bonuses. Now throw on that monks tend to spread their stats out more, and you get a huge disparity in attack rolls. Disarming a fighter doesn't work, thank god that with a wizard you can actually use your feat

 

[tylermalan]

which brings me to my final point:

Monk vs wizard? Be thankful he's trying to disarm instead of trying to grapple.

I agree with the above, and somewhat disagree with Graf. Monks aren't exactly "sub-optimal" IMO. About a year ago I started a thread about a debate me and a few friends had once. The debate was about who would win in a duel, a 20 Monk or a 20 Wizard. Ultimately, many more people sided with the Wizard, but make no mistake - the Monk class is THE mage-killer class. Now, this really only applies when they have some of their higher level abilities than what was in the original post, but its still worth noting.

 

[Tarquis]

It's not only the wizards, but all his bodyguards as well. I'll admit they were 3rd to 4th level bodyguards wielding bastard swords one handed. With his flurrying, he was disarming one per round and grabbing their swords.

Yes, a wizard is weak in melee, so does this mean that effectively a wizard should never try to use a wand, rod or other spell item in combat? Because it will just end up being ripped out of his hand.

I think one thing that bothers me is that the monk does not need a minimum attack roll. Any roll is a disarm attempt. Say a low level monk rolls a 2 and adds +7 due to feats and stuff. This doesn't even Touch (let alone hit) a flat footed peasant, yet the wizard has to beat this roll at -4 or lose his wand (which would surely be harder for the monk to hit in the first place than a flat footed peasant).

Perhaps a touch attack should be required first?

 

[Corsair]

That's number 2 above - -4 penalty for not being a weapon.

Not my point. I was refering to people not seeing that there was a category for worn items which is neither poorly secured, nor well secured.

 

[Stalker0]

The debate was about who would win in a duel, a 20 Monk or a 20 Wizard. Ultimately, many more people sided with the Wizard, but make no mistake - the Monk class is THE mage-killer class.

The monk is one of the better mage killing classes, but in a straight up fight I will go with a 20th level wizard vs a monk any day of the week.

 

[ValhallaGH]

I think one thing that bothers me is that the monk does not need a minimum attack roll. Any roll is a disarm attempt. Say a low level monk rolls a 2 and adds +7 due to feats and stuff. This doesn't even Touch (let alone hit) a flat footed peasant, yet the wizard has to beat this roll at -4 or lose his wand (which would surely be harder for the monk to hit in the first place than a flat footed peasant).

Perhaps a touch attack should be required first?

What's the problem, exactly?

That disarm is too good or that your wizard lost the encounter due to an un-cool trick?

If the former then you need to look at all cases, not just this particular one. If the latter then ... I'm not sure what to tell you.

 

[Darklone]

It's not only the wizards, but all his bodyguards as well. I'll admit they were 3rd to 4th level bodyguards wielding bastard swords one handed. With his flurrying, he was disarming one per round and grabbing their swords.

If I were a bodyguard and he disarms the first one of my buddies, I'd drop my shield and grab my blade with two hands.