DM problems

[Tequila Sunrise]

1. he actually did roll d100 (10% he would be there) to see if the innkeeper was on the trapdoor but when he retold me that he rolled 97 he suddenly paused and said "wait a minute its 1-10 that would make him be on the trapdoor not 90-100. Wow I am so sorry he should have never been there"

... There is nothing about this situation that makes any sense at all. Run for the hills man!

So I am not coming here to complain (though I am sure it sounds that way) I just want a better understanding of the game so that I can intelligently talk to the DM. Instead of walking up saying "you are unfair, change your DM style, this is dumb, I quit" kind of a deal.

While whining and moaning never seem to do much good, a calm yet firm "I'm just not having fun" sometimes does.

About the feats thing I understand that he can do that but if for some reason a DM adds a bunch of feats on, doesn't that make the opponent harder? Isn't that what CR is supposed to measure? So if you have a level 2 guard with 40 feats, he may be level 2 but with that many feats he would be a contest for some pretty impressive foes. So I was wondering if in the case a DM wished to give some extra feats would he in turn bump up the CR a little bit as well?

Yeah, extra feats make NPCs more challenging, but here's the thing: CR is a very rough guideline, at best. The writers applied CRs to different monsters using different standards -- sometimes intentionally, sometimes not. (Dragons for example are intentionally under-CRed.) Often the raw math isn't even consistent within the same CR.

So yeah, an NPC with extra feats might be worth a CR boost, but not even the professionals will agree on how big a boost if any. The CR boost depends on the quality of the feat, the NPC or monster who gets it, and possibly what kind of PC it's being used against. Many DMs will swap out crappy default feats for better ones, and it's still legal by the rules. My point is: NPC and monster design is more an art than a science, even if 3.x gives the impression that there's some grand scheme behind everything.

Oh that brings me to another question. Do NPCs fighting alongside a player make the exp get spread among them as well?

Assuming that the NPCs contributed to the fight, yes.

 

[Olaf the Stout]

I get that you want to know if what your DM is doing is within the rules, so you can learn for when you DM.

What I would suggest is that you get a copy of the PHB, DMG and MM and just have a read through them. That will definitely help you get an idea of how things are meant to work according to the actual rules.

If your DM is as you describe you will not be able to learn how to run a game according to the rules as written from him.

Olaf the Stout

 

[InvincibleWall]

I have actually read PHB and DMG cover to cover now but truthfully neither say anything about "You cannot kill your PCs outright just cuz" but that would be plain out stupid. There seems to be a lot of play in what a DM can do so for the most part there aren't rules in play that actually limit what a DM can do but obviously some things make players want throw D&D out the window and call it a day.


Unfortunately I probably asked my beginning question a but off. The correct way to have probably said it would have been (After learning that true rules about things).

You have heard the story, now what would you do? What have you done in the past? If the DM won't change do I offer to take over for a couple sessions with a new campaign so that I can see what he is going through and so that he knows what we are going through?

I mean I really don't want to "un-invite" the current DM but if his standards are stacked as follows (which they for most purposes seem to be)

1. Realism
2. This is how we always played it
3. House Rules
4. Rule books
5. Player's opinions
6. Fun

Then what can be said to rearrange them in a different order?

As I said before I talked to the DM and most things have been straightened out he basically agreed that he had blown away the players and said that if we wanted to we could back a bit and try again without the blow the PCs away aspects of the last session.

Another thing I wouldn't even know about D&D if it wasn't for him... so I feel that it would be very unkind to just dump him but at the same time it really isn't worth playing a messed up game either.

I sincerely thank everyone who has posted to this thread, because a lot of this information has been very helpful.

 

[Water Bob]

how are we supposed to get equipment at this rate?

Man, you'd hate my game, then. My PCs found a battleaxe and were slathering at the mouth for it. Before that, one was using a pitted iron-headed hunting spear and a dirk. The other was using two hand-axes he took from the wood pile.

They about jumped for joy when they found a weapon made out of steel.

Second is that he makes puzzles that adapt as we try to solve them, an example of this was:

The above (wealth) I agree with as long as that's the "universe" and not only the PCs that have no gear. If gear is rare, then so bit it.

But this second thing makes me think that your GM is a bit immature. He might need to be reminded that it's not him against the players. The GM doesn't "lose".

Remind him that he's a director of a grand film where the story is centered on the player characters. The PCs need to succeed. The game needs to be challenging, yes. But always reward good play and allow the PCs to be heroes. Don't make it easy for them, but allow the players' good ideas to work.

I think that's a learned GM response. It's not natural to play a game and not try to "win". The more experienced GMs know this.

 

[Grogg of the North]

A couple of things:

1) Don't get hung up on your wealth. One of the first games I played in was a low wealth/low magic game. And it was AWESOME. Granted, the world worked that way. We didn't find ourselves in scenarios were we needed magic items to survive. But it certainly made hordes of lizardfolk much scarier. So as long as the world all works the same way (PCs have little equipment but so do the NPCs) don't worry too much.

2) The first game people run is typically horrible. I can attest to that myself and for some of my friends. Typically you're still learning the ropes at this point. This sounds like the scenario in along with ...

3) Your GM is viewing the game as GM vs. PCs. I've been in those games and they never wind up ending well. The simple fact is that the GM cannot lose. But he can help everyone win. The GM is there to work with the PCs. To respond to their actions and do all the grunt work. Remind him/her that this should be about everyone at the table working together to have fun. Which I assume is the reason you're playing D&D.

4) Don't worry about changing monster feats. Sometimes the designers did some really stupid things. Like give a legendary shark Toughness eight million times.

With all that being said, try to see if everyone at the table is still having fun. If the rest of the players are frustrated too you may need to sit down and talk with your GM (repeatedly). You can always suggest that you rotate the GM per week. Give everyone a chance behind the screen and learn what everyone wants. But if no one wants to change, and you're not having fun (The point of the game) it may be time to look for greener pastures and find a new group. Or you could just play the Cheater of Mystra and break the game world.