Do the spells of a slain spellcaster end the instant he is killed?

[James McMurray]

I doubt there are very many people besides Hyp that are actualy bothered by it, and he'd probably be quick to say that he isn't bothered, just amused.

In my games, every spell is handled as follows:

If you become an invalid target because of range issues (i.e. you're no longer within 30' of that other hasted guy) it doesn't matter, you're still affected.

If you become an invalid target because of a change to your basic form or outlook (no longer an animal, no longer willing, become an object, etc.) the effects of the spell are suppressed, but the spell itself is still active and will resume if you become valid again.

If something would turn out to be broken due to the above two general rules, or doesn't fit, it will be answered on a case by case basis.

 

[the_bruiser]

Hyp, I love you

Usually I read these forums at work, where I can not post due to some firewall issue. So I only post on the rare weekends where I get on the boards b/c of some house rule I'd like discussed in that board. But I've wanted to point one thing out for a while. For me, once Hyp starts talking, I know that we're going to get a definitive answer (even if the answer is that the rules are definitely unclear). Usually the people who disagree with him have not read his post with absolute precision for what he has said and what he has not. I'm not sucking up, here, and no, I don't just blindly agree with what he says - I don't think he's right b/c he's Hyp, it's just that whatever Hyp says is convincing, well-structured, and complete.

Sorry to hijack the thread, no reason to post it here in particular, I've just wanted to say for awhile that I appreciate your rigor, Hyp . You should get over to the house rules more, though, so we can hear you express opinions as opposed to analysis.

 

[James McMurray]

So then where is the definitive aswer he's providing? All he's done so far is point out that the rules on this issue are vague. Everyone knew that coming into the thread, so it hasn't exactly been helpful.

Generally Hyp is a very helpful person to have around, but when he gets into his "point out inconsistencies mode" all he usually does is point them out. Offering solutions would be quite a bit more useful.

 

[Hypersmurf]

By the rules I would say "yes" to this. I know it's one of your favorite examples...

Actually, it's not one of my favourite examples unless somebody says "no".

Then I pounce!

But you were too wise to fall for my trap.

Although James McMurray is circling the haunch of meat and licking his lips... but he's given himself the "case by case basis" out, so it won't be any fun to spring it on him

-Hyp.

 

[0-hr]

So if a Druid Wildshapes into a cat, casts Animal Growth on himself with Natural Spell, and reverts to his natural form, he'll retain the size increase, DR, ability modifiers, etc in his humanoid form?

If I cast Hold Person on a human, and his ally Polymorphs him into a ogre, he's still held even though his Type has changed to Giant?

Barring rule zero, yup and yup.

Problems either way and non-sentient (or non-polling) spells are a simpler solution so I'm going with Occam on this one.

All, IMO of course.

 

[James McMurray]

Ot of curiosity, what's the trap?

 

[UltimaGabe]

Unless a spell is an area effect, it makes no difference where the targets move after the spell is cast- if they were affected in the first place, they're still affected, no matter where they move. For example, casting Melf's Acid Arrow on someone, then moving a hundred feet back on your next turn, isn't going to end the spell.

The Levitating person who suddenly becomes unwilling would not be allowed a Saving Throw to end the effects unless an additional Saving Throw was already going to be issued. There's only one save allowed for such spells- for example, halfway through a Cat's Grace spell, you can't decide, "I want to try and make the save again." Otherwise, what would stop an enemy from saying, "I'm going to allow myself to be willing, then become unwilling again to get another Saving Throw." It becomes ridiculous at that point.

Spells do not end when the targets move out of range unless the spell's description or type (such as Area Effect) specifically calls for it. A Chill Metal spell would affect the two targets, and once they move away, the effect would still continue. The "range" & "targets" section of a spell description only counts during the casting of the spell, unless otherwise noted. For Chill Metal, what would happen if the two targets remained within 30 feet of each other, but they both made Full Runs away from you, out of your range? The spell would still continue, because you're not trying to cast the spell on them again. The spell has already been cast.

For the same reason, Invisibility has a Range of Touch- but the target doesn't become visible again once you take your hand off of them. They get no additional saving throw, however, regardless of whether they choose to be willing or not later on.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Generally Hyp is a very helpful person to have around, but when he gets into his "point out inconsistencies mode" all he usually does is point them out. Offering solutions would be quite a bit more useful.

You mean... personal opinion? I do that occasionally, but it's a slippery slope...

Sorry to hijack the thread, no reason to post it here in particular, I've just wanted to say for awhile that I appreciate your rigor, Hyp . You should get over to the house rules more, though, so we can hear you express opinions as opposed to analysis.

To be honest, I'm not particularly good at determining balance... which is what a lot of House Rules threads come down to. The House Rules forum just doesn't interest me that much.

-Hyp.

 

[Taren Seeker]

Actually, it's not one of my favourite examples unless somebody says "no".

Then I pounce!

But you were too wise to fall for my trap.

Although James McMurray is circling the haunch of meat and licking his lips... but he's given himself the "case by case basis" out, so it won't be any fun to spring it on him

-Hyp.

Bah, I say yes...stack 'em all and let god sort them out.

Or the DM.

It's the powergamer's motto.

 

[Darklone]

Personal opinion. Like Nightfall and me. (Pimp daddies we are, heyhoheyho).

But Hyp is going for the ultimate truth SCHTICK. Of course, that's crossing into hongs territory, but the boards seem to be big enough for both.