Does anyone else think it is ridiculous that Sorcerers use components and such?

[rootbeergnome]

The Sorcerer class is designed to have a different flavor from wizards, but it says in the Player's HandBook that Sorcerers use material, verbal, and somatic components that are identical to the Wizard's casting method. It even states that it cannot be determined just by watching them cast spells who is the wizard and who is the sorcerer. So, my interpretation is that the only difference in flavor is that sorcerers dont have to memorize and they get simple weapon proficiency. I dont consider this flavor, it is mechanical. This leaves a sour taste in my mouth. I can't imagine a sorcerer being like:
"So, when I pick up this sand, or a cricket, or a rose petal, and say 'Comatosium Insomnium' and wave my hand all weird, the people I point at fall asleep, well thats easy."

It is just ridiculous to me. What are the chances that a Sorcerer would just discover the exact material, somatic, and verbal components of a spell? This does not portray sorcerers as having a great magic that stems from within, it portrays them as being lucky enough to figure out a way to cast a wizard's spell. What are everyone's thoughts on this?

 

[Crothian]

There's a feat you can take to get rid of material components. Monte's Sorcerer doesn't use material components, so you can use an alt version.

Personally, I see spells as behaving the same way for everyone. To do a fireball you need bat guino. That's just the way magic works. It works the same way for everyone. Why should sorcereers be special and find a better way to cast spells?

 

[turtle]

give a small exp penalty for spells with expensive material components... say 1 exp / 25 gold pieces.

 

[hong]

I think the situation right now with sorcs and wizards is a compromise between what the designers originally intended for the main arcane spellcasting class, and continuity concerns.

If you look at the CRPG Pool of Radiance 2, there are only sorcs in that game, and no wizards. POR2 was designed during the early stages of 3E, when a lot of things were still up in the air. This suggests to me that the sorc's spontaneous-casting mechanic was what was originally going to be used for the wizard, without any separate sorcerer class. For one reason or other this was changed, and now we have separate wizard and sorc classes.

1 theory is that only having spontaneous casting didn't go down too well in various circles, since it's quite a major break from the traditional prepare/cast mechanic that D&D magic has always used. Hence the wizard was redesigned, and a separate sorcerer class was created to use spontaneous casting. Which is a good thing; there have always been lots of people who didn't like Vancian-style prepare/cast magic. The sorc probably fits these people's intuitions of how magic should work, better than does the wizard.

The situation now is a bit messy, with two classes that essentially share the same niche. This is reflected in how people keep coming up with tweaks that make the sorc more like the wizard, and vice-versa.

Nevertheless, the spontaneous casting mechanic is just that: a mechanic. It doesn't require a backstory about magic in the blood, or descent from dragons or anything like that. You could have a world where mages gain spells through study and hard work, and they could still cast spells like sorcs. In 4E, I reckon you'll probably see spell prep disappear entirely, once people have become sufficiently comfortable with spontaneous casting. Remember, you heard it here first.

 

[Ulrick]

I've almost thrown out all spell components except for those spells requiring rare types of components. For sorcerers, I simply don't have them use components at all, judging their magic similar to "mutant powers."

It hasn't unbalanced much so far.


Ulrick

 

[GrimJesta]

I totally ditched the sorcerers need for components. I keep wizards using them as its more 'wizardly' (and the price you pay for more spells). Sorcies have dragon blood in them, and that is how they cast their spells.

-=Grim=-

 

[Warchild]

Yep, like the others, i believe that was the very first rule "0" our group made when we got 3E on the table.

 

[seankreynolds]

It makes sense to keep it

Two comments, both based on stuff I heard from other people:

Ryan Dancey at Gen Con:
"The wizard is the guy who studied the laws of magic and knows what things done in the right order produce magical effects, and he knows _why_. The sorcerer is the guy who knows that if he points a stick at a guy, squeezes one eye shut, and screams a couple of encouraging words, the guy across the lawn bursts into flames; he doesn't know why it works, he just _knows_ that it does."

Some guy on Eric Noah's old site:
"I always saw the sorcerer as one who, if you asked him about his teenage years, says, 'I never thought that it was weird that I could climb sheer walls, or that I had a habit of eating spiders.'"


Wizards study how to use the tools of magic. Sorcerers know how to use those tools instictively. Both of them still have to use the tools.

 

[RangerWickett]

Hey, Sean, or anyone else who was on the original design team or a playtester, do you think there's much of a chance of us ever hearing about what various stages the development of 3e went through? Can we hear what you folks considered putting in but kept out?

 

[Kai Lord]

Re: It makes sense to keep it

Two comments, both based on stuff I heard from other people:

Ryan Dancey at Gen Con:
"The wizard is the guy who studied the laws of magic and knows what things done in the right order produce magical effects, and he knows _why_. The sorcerer is the guy who knows that if he points a stick at a guy, squeezes one eye shut, and screams a couple of encouraging words, the guy across the lawn bursts into flames; he doesn't know why it works, he just _knows_ that it does."

That sounds like sorcerers should have been templates instead. The "Dragon-blooded" template, perhaps. Imagine if one of these innately intuned magic using sorcerer-types poured himself into learning the craft of magic the way wizards do. All wizardry essentially is is a *skill* that some take the time to master. Those with inborn *talent* should surely have the oppurtunity to realize much greater potential.