Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
Cause we just got what was going to be Dark Sun.
D&D 5E "Doom Sun" − reconstructing a 5e Dark Sun setting for the DMs Guild
Tales and Chronicles
Jewel of the North, formerly know as vincegetorix
That kinda depend if you see Wildspaces as single solar systems or more like pocket galaxies. I think a real life black hole would have to be supermassive to warp a whole Wildspace, but my vision of the whole Astral Sea thing has them as pretty large, much more than our solar system. The image in the book does show the ''hole'' as many times bigger than the other planets. IIRC, regular black holes arent all that big.
And, I mean, a bunch of Gods punching a hole in space kind of deserve the name supermassive. Or at least Gargantuan Back Holes, in D&D parlance!
Yaarel
He Mage
As far as I can tell:
2e athas elf = 5e wood elf
The 5e customizable ability score improvements and swaps, allows any ability scores. Also, the 2e score adjustments seem to disagree with the narrative. The narrative describes the elf has exhibiting extreme Constitution, where running at full speed for days at a time is routine: "a deadly force of endurance". But the 2e mechanics assigns a −2 penalty to the Constitution score. However one interprets this, 5e allows players and DMs to stat the wood elf that way.
The athas elf is tall, roughly 7 feet. But in 5e, this is still Medium size, and players and DMs can make their heights and weights as they want.
The 5e wood elf has the proficiency with swords and bows where the athas elf has a bonus to the same.
The athas elf has a bonus to surprising others, relating to stealth in nature. The wood elf has the Mask of the Wild that can hide even when only lightly obscured by "natural phenomena", which includes dusty wind. This isnt an exact match, but it is thematically similar.
The important part is the wood elf Fleet of Foot trait, whose increase in speed matches the athas elf running trope.
Of course, in Dark Sun, the name "wood" elf would be odd. A "cactus" elf or a "wilderness" elf or a "desert" elf or a "dust" elf, might make more sense. Then again, this is the only kind of elf in the Dark Sun setting (if I recall correctly), so would normally be "the" elf. I know 4e Dark Sun has an eladrin that I am fond of, but for the moment I am focusing on the original 2e themes.
All in, the 2e Dark Sun elf and the 5e wood elf correspond well enough.
In later supplements, the athas elf has resistance against natural heat and cold, but not trance nor charm resistance. A 5e wood elf could make a similar swap.
2e athas elf = 5e wood elf
The 5e customizable ability score improvements and swaps, allows any ability scores. Also, the 2e score adjustments seem to disagree with the narrative. The narrative describes the elf has exhibiting extreme Constitution, where running at full speed for days at a time is routine: "a deadly force of endurance". But the 2e mechanics assigns a −2 penalty to the Constitution score. However one interprets this, 5e allows players and DMs to stat the wood elf that way.
The athas elf is tall, roughly 7 feet. But in 5e, this is still Medium size, and players and DMs can make their heights and weights as they want.
The 5e wood elf has the proficiency with swords and bows where the athas elf has a bonus to the same.
The athas elf has a bonus to surprising others, relating to stealth in nature. The wood elf has the Mask of the Wild that can hide even when only lightly obscured by "natural phenomena", which includes dusty wind. This isnt an exact match, but it is thematically similar.
The important part is the wood elf Fleet of Foot trait, whose increase in speed matches the athas elf running trope.
Of course, in Dark Sun, the name "wood" elf would be odd. A "cactus" elf or a "wilderness" elf or a "desert" elf or a "dust" elf, might make more sense. Then again, this is the only kind of elf in the Dark Sun setting (if I recall correctly), so would normally be "the" elf. I know 4e Dark Sun has an eladrin that I am fond of, but for the moment I am focusing on the original 2e themes.
All in, the 2e Dark Sun elf and the 5e wood elf correspond well enough.
In later supplements, the athas elf has resistance against natural heat and cold, but not trance nor charm resistance. A 5e wood elf could make a similar swap.
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darjr
I crit!
Was, maybe. I guess we’ll just have to disagree.
Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
I’d say I hope you’re right, but I no longer think I’ll enjoy whatever WotC ends up doing with Dark Sun when/if they eventually bring it back, so I’m not really invested in it either way. I guess I hope the folks who do still want it will get it sooner rather than later.
Yaarel
He Mage
The Dawn War is part of the Forgotten Realms setting, part of its timeline.
Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
I mean, it is now. But it originated with 4e’s assumed setting, and the DMG’s Dawn War pantheon is the same as the 4e pantheon.
Yaarel
He Mage
Heh, that is kinda what I mean about FR being the black hole of D&D settings.
Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
Would you say it’s a supermassive black hole, or more of a magic black space sarlac?
Ruin Explorer
Legend
I think you're kind of both right.
This is a very obvious not-Dark Sun. In fact, what it plus "Athasspace" looks like is that, right up until fairly recently, this was going to be the 5E take on Dark Sun.
However, something caused a last-minute (or at least "last quarter of the game") change of plans. So late that maps were made with the old name in place and even distributed digitally and so on. Fyreen almost certainly was Athas, imho. It somewhat much doubt that a huge amount of the text was re-written, because from the pictures, it looks fairly together and well-written, and not some sort of last-minute deal. So the 5E take on Athas was probably pretty different.
So why did they change course? To me there seem two obvious possibilities:
1) They felt like it was a waste to put any version of actual, named Athas into Spelljammer, because they intend to make an Athas setting, but just not any time soon. This might have been a very recent decision. Clearly they had planned to put Athas in previously.
2) The specific take on Athas that was previously in Spelljammer was decided against. So, it could be that the Fyreen-Athas was decided as not cool enough, or too wack. Or it could be a more standard Athas was planned, but the book was cancelled or punted into the future. Ray Winninger did say they often cancel setting books (and he seemed to be implying sometimes it was pretty late in the day).
Either way, in the short term, it seems an Athas book is unlikely, because either they've either A) suddenly decided they want a full Athas book where previously it wasn't going to be one, B) decided that the approach for Athas, whatever it was, was wrong, or C) cancelled an Athas book entirely, which the setting would previously have match.
I actually think C is kind of the least likely there. But again, in the short term, i.e. next year or two, I think it's very unlikely we'll see an Athas book because of this. But equally, in the significantly longer term, like 3+ years, the decision not to use the Athas name here means that they have flexibility and could well be planning an Athas book.
If I'm really crystal-ballin' it, like my honest prognostication, then my theory would be, this was essentially a "trailer" for a wilder 5E Athas remake, but they cancelled that, because they want to go with a more standard Athas. You may say "wishful thinking!", but I'm on record as actually hoping for a remake (i.e. similar ideas but different) of Athas rather than a reboot (i.e. same ideas, not merely similar), and I think a reboot is now more likely. Just in 3+ years.
Obviously I may be on crack here.
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