Eberron- And why I cannot jump onboard? A different take

[Henry]

The implication that someone that experienced has effectively lost her childhood, I would imagine. Whether by divine manifestation or not, a 9-year old who is 16th level, is no longer a child.

Keith, thanks for the glimpses and the helping us try and see the big picture behind the veil. I'm all for the setting, even though I may never see it used for quite some time. The concept of the "1930's pulp genre" feel to the setting is a great one - one that in my opinion WotC has SUCKED at conveying thus far (no offense to Bill or Rich - but it's taken you hammering the point multiple times to get it across, and the slideshow did not convey what its creator set out to convey).

I may be operating in misconceptionville, but I think I "get" the setting, and I'm excited about the idea of it. But I have the prediction that, moreso than any other setting, this one will have a lot of people who dislike it now will grow to love it, and a lot of people who like what they "think" the concept is will grow to dislike it - I have the feeling we will see a 180 degree audience flop in many instances. Hopefully, if it happens, the numbers will be favorable.

Keep writing, Keith! I'll keep my fingers crossed and money in hand.

BTW, Keith, if you get to answer this: have the main writing chores on the core book been finished, to your knowledge?

 

[Storm Raven]

Someone had a great quote on the WotC boards, 'You mean for 1000 years we have been summoning lightning but it never occured to anyone to use it for something other than blasting your enemies?'

It shouldn't be that surprising. The Chinese had gunpowder for hundreds of years, but never thought to use it to kill their enemies. The Greeks developed steam engines, but no one figured out a use for them for thousands of years. We knew how to make wire for centuries before anyone thought to make the paperclip.

These sorts of leaps seem obvious to us now, because we see the results every day. But before they are made, centuries can go by before anyone thinks to try them.

 

[Hellcow]

Apologies for my laziness in choosing examples. You are correct that I did not choose my examples well. I suppose I was going more on the concept that part of the design concept behind this world was taking everything in the D&D palette and finding a place for it. I remember the dinosaurs being mentioned either by you or by WotC as an example of finding a home for something because it's in the books. Are you doing something original with ecology in your world or are you using the typical D&D palette? My impression was the latter so please correct me if I am wrong.

I'd like to say "both." Yes, one of the goals was to use the creatures provided in the MM, because it *is* a core book. But there are a few factors in this:

* Just because "Everything has a logical place in the world" does not mean "everything is automatically present in the world." Taking yuan-ti as an example: they are not even mentioned in the Campaign Setting Book, but I could tell you immediately where I could logically add a yuan-ti civilization if I wanted one, without creating questions of the impact it had on the rest of the setting -- and I'd expect anyone else familiar with the setting to be able to do the same.

* We have tried to provide unique twists for the iconic creatures that are mentioned. They aren't just present because they are in the MM -- they have interesting roles to play.

* We've tried to develop a few creatures that are in the MM but don't usually receive much attention or explanation -- dinosaurs, sure, but also things like rakshasa (as hinted at in the current WotC web article) -- creatures that have interesting potential but aren't used as often. If The Complete Guide to Beholders PDF is still on sale for $1, check that out, and you can see the sort of thing I like to do with traditional creatures (even if there obviously isn't enough room for that level of detail on each creature in the campaign setting).
* There are also new creatures unique to the campaign setting. Some of these are tied to existing creatures -- creature A fills this place in Eberron, and as a result, creature B has evolved from it.

The same does go for magic. The magic used by society is the magic in the PHB, with a few new spells -- not blanket magitech counterparts for every modern convenience. Thus, it's not the case that advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology -- it's still definitely magic. Yes, it is defined by the D&D tropes; the goal was to extrapolate from D&D in an interesting manner, making use of the material in the corebooks, not to reinvent the wheel.

BTW, Keith, if you get to answer this: have the main writing chores on the core book been finished, to your knowledge?

I honestly couldn't tell you. My work on the core book was done quite some time ago -- I've worked on two more Eberron projects since then -- but I don't know the final status of the core book. I know playtesting and balancing is still going on, so certainly nothing seen in the previews is set in stone.

I wasn't too impressed by the artificer (I think the FR gnome artificer worked better),

I am curious what people think about the artificer. My favorite things are the weapon and armor augmentations -- personal weapon augmentation makes an artificer with a crossbow a very versatile ranged combatant at low levels. Obviously the full text of the augmentations hasn't been released, but you can still get the basic idea from the briefs listed in the article. So far, I've found it to be a fun character to have in a game, but as always, your mileage may vary.

 

[Felon]

Keith, I have a couple of questions that you may or may not be capable of indulging:

1) Are there guns in Eberron, either magical or straight-up chemical slugthrowers? Would a city guard just be armed with a plain old sword?

2) One of the articles mentioned that there would be places for DM's to use some of the non-PHB core classes in Eberron. Are classes from the Complete Warrior or Minis Handbook referred to specifically in the Eberron material?

 

[MrFilthyIke]

2) One of the articles mentioned that there would be places for DM's to use some of the non-PHB core classes in Eberron. Are classes from the Complete Warrior or Minis Handbook referred to specifically in the Eberron material?

That's a good question, as the Hexblade seems to be popular in talking with others.

 

[Hellcow]

1) Are there guns in Eberron, either magical or straight-up chemical slugthrowers? Would a city guard just be armed with a plain old sword?

First off, it's important to note that Eberron is a world, and as such contains a wide variety of cultures -- the city guard will vary from one to the next. However, there are no guns in Eberron. There are wands (and possibly new wand options with the artificer and such), but wands are still spell trigger items and still considerably more expensive than a crossbow. So the average city guard will be using a sword and crossbow. In a major city of an advanced nation, however, there may be a unit of magewrights with wands that can be called in to help handle major emergencies.

2) One of the articles mentioned that there would be places for DM's to use some of the non-PHB core classes in Eberron. Are classes from the Complete Warrior or Minis Handbook referred to specifically in the Eberron material?

Neither book was out when I wrote my part of the corebook. My guess is that they are not refered to specifically, because you should be able to play with just the three core books. Psionics are obviously a notable exception, but you can play in Eberron and not use psionics (either by avoiding certain parts of the world or using substitute abilities, as the MM does with the Mind Flayer).

With that said, it should be a fairly simple matter to incorporate any of the classes into the setting; I can think of a few places for even some of the stranger classes that come to mind. I admit that samurai is a tough one, but if someone wanted to play a samurai, I know where I'd have them come from.

As a side note - because the guns question is already addressed there - here's a good fan-created Eberron FAQ site:
http://www.coveworld.net/eberron/

 

[mearls]

Jumping Aboard Eberron

Hey all,

I think Eberron faces an uphill battle with a lot of people because we've known about it for some time without seeing any details or new information. When D&D 3e was announced, WotC was ready with 12 months of steady updates. From the first announcement, we had an idea of the type of changes we could expect from the game.

In Eberron's case, the WotC design team had to work on creating the product before they could really produce previews for it. Only in the past couple months have we started seeing really meaty previews in Dragon. There was a significant period of time where there wasn't any news on it, and I think that hurt its image. It was announced at GenCon but White Wolf's announcement of the World of Darkness re-boot kind of drowned it out. Then, for months we didn't hear anything new.

Personally, I don't usually buy new game worlds. Back when I played 2e, I stuck to Greyhawk precisely because there was so little support for it. I had a lot more flexibility to use it as I wish, and there was a lot more ideas and plot outlines than established history and canon.

I liked a few bits of the Eberron preview from GenCon, but overall I didn't have a real sense of the world. Now that WotC can give us a clearer picture in the Dragon previews, it's really shaping up. I like the artificer class, and it looks like even if the world doesn't appeal to you there'll be enough new rule material to make it a good purchase. So far, this looks like it'll be interesting. I'm planning on buying the core book and giving it a whirl.

Will it be the biggest thing since twenty sided dice that didn't just repeat 1 - 10 twice? Will it be the biggest flop since those Buck Rogers RPGs TSR released? I really don't care, as long as I and my group have fun with it. I'm not sure if going back to doing lots of worlds is a good idea for WotC from a business standpoint, but I don't know if that's their goal. Honestly, I'd like to see it do really well just to shut up some of the toads on the WotC boards that are going overboard with their hate for it.

So, put me down as looking forward to Eberron.

 

[BluWolf]

I will buy the book because it will be interesting to see someone else's interpretation son the same concepts. My own campaing world (and submission), Stormworld, is very similar.

It will be interesting to see how someone that can actually write well pulls off some of the concepts.

Congratulations by the way.

 

[MerricB]

The implication that someone that experienced has effectively lost her childhood, I would imagine. Whether by divine manifestation or not, a 9-year old who is 16th level, is no longer a child.

That's basically it. The demands on her and - most likely - the loss of friendships. You know that Spiderman quote, "With great power comes great responsibility"? Well, apply it to a 9-year-old girl and tremble.

There have been many things I've liked hearing about Eberron, but that's the one thing that really stands out for me.

Well done, Keith!

Cheers!

 

[MrFilthyIke]

Will it be the biggest flop since those Buck Rogers RPGs TSR released?.

I feel so alone.

I loved the Buck Rogers, the RPG and the computer game.

Loved it. Loved it so much I tracked down a near mint copy and got it
on eBay. I am truly ecclectic, I guess.