Fiery Burst: Overpowered?

[Stalker0]

So we are trying out the reserve feats, and already there's some concern that they might be overpowered.

We are 4th level, and the sorc in the group just picked it up. Basicaly, as long as he has one spell slot ready, he can do 2d6 damage in a small burst, with a DC as high as any of his 2nd level spells.

At this level that seems extrememly good. First all, its an area effect, something you don't normally see until 3rd level spells. 2nd, even on a successful save it deals 1d6 damage. That's not a whole lot until you realize unless the creature has evasion (very rare at this point), he's always going to take 1d6. When you consider fighters still have to hit that seems like good damage. And of course its at will.

The other thing is its not even spell like its supernatural. There are no components, no indication at all the person is casting it. He could stand there with things catching on fire, and no one could tell its him. That's pretty good at any level, at 4th, its incredible. Of course, let us not forget that it turns his burning hands into 5d4 damage, and will let him get an extra ray from scorching ray one level earlier than normal.

So what do you all think. We are debating whether to bring reserve feats further into the mold but this one has some people worried.

 

[FireLance]

We are 4th level, and the sorc in the group just picked it up. Basicaly, as long as he has one spell slot ready, he can do 2d6 damage in a small burst, with a DC as high as any of his 2nd level spells.

How has the sorcerer "just" picked up the feat at 4th level? Are you playing by different rules for feat acquisition?

 

[FireLance]

In addition, while supernatural abilities cannot be disrupted or dispelled, and do not provoke attacks of opportunity, the rules do not explicitly state that the effect cannot be traced back to the spellcaster. In fact, for several supernatural abilities, it is quite obvious who is the person or creature using the ability, e.g. turn undead, bardic music, lay on hands, dragon breath. In my games, I would simply rule that the fiery burst clearly originates from the spellcaster.

 

[Stalker0]

Ah, I should clarify. We are using an alternative sorc that gets spell progression like a wizard. So he actually took it at 3rd.

Come to think of it perhaps that is why it seems so good. Normally only a wizard could get it at that level, and its probably not as good with a wizard, though I think its still pretty amazing.

 

[Stalker0]

In addition, while supernatural abilities cannot be disrupted or dispelled, and do not provoke attacks of opportunity, the rules do not explicitly state that the effect cannot be traced back to the spellcaster. In fact, for several supernatural abilities, it is quite obvious who is the person or creature using the ability, e.g. turn undead, bardic music, lay on hands, dragon breath. In my games, I would simply rule that the fiery burst clearly originates from the spellcaster.

It has no components, no concentration check, and no obvious ties to the person. Turn undead produces glowing light, bardic music is singing, dragon breath comes from the person. There's NOTHING to look at and say, oh he must be doing this.

 

[FireLance]

It has no components, no concentration check, and no obvious ties to the person. Turn undead produces glowing light, bardic music is singing, dragon breath comes from the person. There's NOTHING to look at and say, oh he must be doing this.

Actually, I don't think there's anything in Turn Undead that states that it produces glowing light. The "obvious factor" is that the cleric must present his holy symbol. So, if the rules don't explicitly say that there is no way to trace the fiery blast back to the spellcaster, I'd simply rule that the blast does obviously originate from him, in line with these other supernatural abilities.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

I don't think the sky is falling. So a wizard 3 can get 2d6 in a small area every round, reflex half?

Sure, the burst part is nice, but the 3.5 (on average) fire damage more or less guaranteed (no fire resistance and no evasion involved) aren't that that great. Since combats often last only a couple rounds, you might be better served with one 4d6 scorching ray to put him down at once.

And a fighter with Great Cleave and a half-decent strength and (let's talk about 4th level) Weapon Specialisation can do some nasty things, too:

+1 Greatsword, Str 17, Weapon Spec means 2d6+7 per hit, with something like +9 to hit.

And, very soon, the 2d6 fire damage will pale and be near useless, but the fighter will get a better attack bonus, more strength, more attacks.

 

[FireLance]

And, very soon, the 2d6 fire damage will pale and be near useless, but the fighter will get a better attack bonus, more strength, more attacks.

The 2d6 damage will scale whenever the character learns a higher level [Fire] spell, though. If he learns delayed blast fireball at 14th level, he will do 7d6 damage with each blast.

 

[Plane Sailing]

The 2d6 damage will scale whenever the character learns a higher level [Fire] spell, though. If he learns delayed blast fireball at 14th level, he will do 7d6 damage with each blast.

... which he would be unlikely to be doing in any of his serious fights, because the equivalent of using an underranged, low area wand of fireballs when you are 14th level would be a pretty strange thing to be doing.

i.e. it wouldn't be his front line attack or even his second line attack in most cases, but gives him a fun effective thing to do when it's not that serious IMO.

Cheers

 

[brehobit]

As a note, the draconic heritage feat that grants a breath weapon for 2d6/spell level sacrificed is pretty darn scary too. You lose the spell, but 4d6 in a 30' cone is pretty sweet at 3rd level.

Mark