WotC Filing: Wizards of the Coast makes up roughly 70% of Hasbro's value

[Parmandur]

I think this undersells it pretty dramatically. We're all used to MtG being the golden goose and DnD being funded by it, but I think if you look at the growth, the amazon rankings for the PHB still, etc, the picture is pretty clear that DnD is doing well enough that it could keep another property afloat, if need be.

It's true, D&D is doing well: but Magic is more of a license to print money than ever.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

It was still at a time when military service of some sort was a widely held social expectation and GIs a more romantic ideal - they were the heroes of WWII, after all. My father and almost all of my uncles served in some capacity (from active to reserves) in the 1950s and into the early 1960s. Plus, they were right on the heels of Kennedy and his "ask not what your country can do for you..." that inspired a lot of young men to volunteer and get sent to Vietnam. That whole milieu was largely blown away by the disillusionment of Vietnam but you can see it in the experiences of the late Silent Generation cohort.

I think the romantic ideal of a GI is Ukraine now, not American at all. A Ukrainian GI Joe would sell like Hot cakes, I hate to say it, but it would, folks like a arse kicking underdog.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

It's true, D&D is doing well: but Magic is more of a license to print money than ever.

Sure. I just don't think that the state of DnD comes across at all when folks insist on talking about it's success as secondary to MtG, which we don't actually even know is still the case, and is almost certainly vastly less the case than it was a decade ago.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

It's true, D&D is doing well: but Magic is more of a license to print money than ever.

I think increasingly they both are, MtG is still bigger profit wise (they call it the Magic the Crackening for a reason), but the lines between the two IPs are blurring, the popular of D&D IPs are as popular or more then their MtG counterparts, it's the collectable, competitive nature of MtG that makes it more popular, because AFR was the best selling MtG Summer set and that was with huge complaints that it was under powered.

That reminds it's been brought to my attention by someone that the Warhammer Commander Decks might be be a test to see if WotC can sell Warhammer products ahead of a possible purchase of Games Workshop itself by WotC.

It's a smart move and while very expensive purchase, it brings a ton of value to WotC and Games Workshop. WotC can do Warhammer: Sigmar/40k/classic D&D 5e setting books, more MtG Warhammer decks, secret lairs, or sets, a Birthright, Ravnica, Theros, or Forgotten Realms war game using Games Workshop skills, expand the Games Workshop's Black Library to include D&D & MtG novels lines, more D&D minis, MtG staff can help build a better secondary market for Warhammer minis, increase collectablity, and so much more.

 

[Parmandur]

Sure. I just don't think that the state of DnD comes across at all when folks insist on talking about it's success as secondary to MtG, which we don't actually even know is still the case, and is almost certainly vastly less the case than it was a decade ago.

D&D is definitely carrying It's own weight now: but still.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

D&D is definitely carrying It's own weight now: but still.

But still nothing, D&D carrying it's own weight is huge. Like, a much bigger deal than "MtG is in a popularity spike right now".

But more on topic, it's also not accurate to act like wotc is such a big deal right now mostly because of MtG. Like, even if MtG is still bigger, the margin is not that big anymore.

Like...MtG isn't the IP getting several tv shows and a movie right now. DnD is reaching the point where very little further growth is needed for it to not be a niche interest anymore. The fact that MtG is also big just isn't as relelvant to discussions about DND's success as it was a decade ago.

 

[Parmandur]

But still nothing, D&D carrying it's own weight is huge. Like, a much bigger deal than "MtG is in a popularity spike right now".

But more on topic, it's also not accurate to act like wotc is such a big deal right now mostly because of MtG. Like, even if MtG is still bigger, the margin is not that big anymore.

Like...MtG isn't the IP getting several tv shows and a movie right now. DnD is reaching the point where very little further growth is needed for it to not be a niche interest anymore. The fact that MtG is also big just isn't as relelvant to discussions about DND's success as it was a decade ago.

I mean, MtG is getting a bunch of media, as well, we just dontslk about thst here. It's more than just a spike, Arena has caused geometric growth in Magic revenue. The crazy thing is thst the ratio might be the same, even if D&D is bigger than ever and mainstream now.

I'm not putting down D&D, just pointing out that WotC is feasting. Which ia what the brokers want to take advantage of.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

To think just a couple of years ago folks were speculating about Games Workshop buying Wizards of the Coast, now flesh are wondering if Wizards will buy Games Workshop (which just cost and having fiscal resources to do it, makes way more sense anyways).

 

[Dausuul]

But still nothing, D&D carrying it's own weight is huge. Like, a much bigger deal than "MtG is in a popularity spike right now".

But more on topic, it's also not accurate to act like wotc is such a big deal right now mostly because of MtG. Like, even if MtG is still bigger, the margin is not that big anymore.

Like...MtG isn't the IP getting several tv shows and a movie right now. DnD is reaching the point where very little further growth is needed for it to not be a niche interest anymore. The fact that MtG is also big just isn't as relelvant to discussions about DND's success as it was a decade ago.

It's important to distinguish between popularity and profitability, too. D&D has always struggled with finding a sustainable business model; the game by its nature doesn't require a lot of ongoing investment by players. Meanwhile, Magic is brilliantly engineered to suck money out of wallets (he said, refreshing to see if there were any more New Capenna spoilers up). So at the same level of popularity, M:tG will be far more profitable.

By this point, I would not be at all surprised to learn that D&D had become significantly more popular than Magic, even though Magic likely continues to bring in more money. Hence all the spinoffs and licensing--Wizards is looking for ways to tap the power of that market.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

It's important to distinguish between popularity and profitability, too. D&D has always struggled with finding a sustainable business model; the game by its nature doesn't require a lot of ongoing investment by players. Meanwhile, Magic is brilliantly engineered to suck money out of wallets (he said, refreshing to see if there were any more New Capenna spoilers up). So at the same level of popularity, M:tG will be far more profitable.

By this point, I would not be at all surprised to learn that D&D had become significantly more popular than Magic, even though Magic likely continues to bring in more money. Hence all the spinoffs and licensing--Wizards is looking for ways to tap the power of that market.

So far BG3 and Forgotten Realms/D&D sets in MtG are doing well, by July it will be 3 sets & a secret lair (AFR, CLB, AH: BG, and the D&D cartoon secret lair).