For Nail - The Psion

[Thanee]

Apart from fixing the powers, which have the biggest discrepancies (i.e. no +1 DC/+1 PP powers, Dispel Psionics has to be augmented from 5 onwards, Psionic Dominate may not allow to mimic Dominate Monster before 15th/16th level, Energy Missile has no extra targets, but can be augmented for one additional target per +2 PP (max 5), all Energy Powers have one fixed energy type, which is chosen when the power is learned; a feat to alter that would then have to be added, similar to Energy Substitution), and removing the feats and powers, which really should not exist (Metamorphic Transfer, probably also Overchannel, Quicken Power and Schism), I would mostly make their power progression more akin to the sorcerer's and give them both, Cha and Int as caster abilities (Cha for DC, Int for PP).

However, I would also make some of the feats, that require Psionic Focus (mainly Power Penetration and Psionic Endowment), more useful, by having them work while the character is psionically focused without expending the focus (and putting their effect in line with the spellcasting feats... +2/+4 against PR/SR and +1 DC to a single discipline).

Expanding the power list in some really lacking areas might also be a good idea.

Something like that.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Nail]

...but the psion requires fewer of the party's resources to recover afterward.

Heh, heh. I get to see that as things are now!

 

[DreamChaser]

Apart from fixing the powers, which have the biggest discrepancies (i.e. no +1 DC/+1 PP powers, Dispel Psionics has to be augmented from 5 onwards, Psionic Dominate may not allow to mimic Dominate Monster before 15th/16th level, Energy Missile has no extra targets, but can be augmented for one additional target per +2 PP (max 5), all Energy Powers have one fixed energy type, which is chosen when the power is learned; a feat to alter that would then have to be added, similar to Energy Substitution), and removing the feats and powers, which really should not exist (Metamorphic Transfer, probably also Overchannel, Quicken Power and Schism), I would mostly make their power progression more akin to the sorcerer's and give them both, Cha and Int as caster abilities (Cha for DC, Int for PP).

However, I would also make some of the feats, that require Psionic Focus (mainly Power Penetration and Psionic Endowment), more useful, by having them work while the character is psionically focused without expending the focus (and putting their effect in line with the spellcasting feats... +2/+4 against PR/SR and +1 DC to a single discipline).

Interesting. You and I really do view things very differently. I personally would not want to play the class you have described and feel it would be both too weak (especially with the mixed stat dependency) and too similar to the magic system and thus it would defeat the point (in my opinion) of making a separate system.

I would rather have all the energy powers scaled back to 1d4 base with free reign of energy type than have the free reign taken away.

Just my thoughts. Not something we'll likely find consensus on.

DC

 

[Thanee]

I personally would not want to play the class you have described and feel it would be both too weak

A logical conclusion, if you consider them balanced with sorcerers and wizards (and the core rules in general) as is.

(especially with the mixed stat dependency)

I don't think that this is so bad as it sounds. It's just a fairly easy way to put a limit on their options (see above), I think.

...and too similar to the magic system and thus it would defeat the point (in my opinion) of making a separate system.

This I do not understand. In what way would that be too similar to the magic system?

Just my thoughts. Not something we'll likely find consensus on.

Heh. That might be.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

But it's not generally effective in potion form.

Any reasonable cost potions will have a duration of one to six minutes--which is short enough that they will only be available as a pre-buff when you know you're attacking in the next few rounds. To use them in an unexpected combat or one that is not anticipated down to 30 seconds of or so of its start means using a move action and a standard action in the first round of combat.

It's still worth it for some characters, but, for the majority of melee characters in the majority of situations, it actually makes them less effective rather than more since they would otherwise move and attack in that round then make a full attack in the next round instead of drinking a potion then making a full attack charge. The power of the psionic versions lies in the fact that they're swift actions and therefore can be used to move/charge+full attack in the first round of any combat.
In a combat without round/level buffs active:
Round 1:
Potion= no attacks
Nothing=move + single attack
Psi power=move/charge + full attack

Round 2:
Potion=charge+full attack
Nothing=full attack
Psi power=full attack (or use the power again to move and full attack someone else, but that gets cost prohibitive quickly for characters with only a few psiwar levels).

The Savage Species version is a Drd1, Sor/Wiz2 spell with a min/level duration.

That's 50gp in potion form.

-Hyp.

 

[The Iron Mark]

Myth: The XPH is Overpowered

That's all I have to say about this.

 

[Nifft]

Very cool, Nifft! Keep us posted.....what a meat-grinder adventurer!

...and I'm playing with a DM who takes NPC losses personally, it seems. :roll-freekin'-eyes:

-- N

 

[Thanee]

That's all I have to say about this.

That's not a whole lot.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Nail]

Myth: The XPH is Overpowered

That's all I have to say about this.

Ooooh, a helpful post.

 

[Vurt]

Been following this thread fairly regularly, mulling over all the ideas presented, but still haven't come to a decision one way or another regarding the pwnage of the psion.

I suspect much of the conflict stems from the kineticist really stepping on the sorcerer's toes, handily taking over as the king "blaster" class. I've known some players who really enjoy dishing out the damage, and ever since it's introduction, that's the niche I constantly see the sorcerer filling. Now he has to compete with the kineticist and, to a lesser extent, the warmage.

My gut feeling tells me that, one way or another, it's all about the spell list. What is and what isn't available, and to a lesser degree, when. You could easily argue the sorcerer and cleric aren't balanced against each other if you didn't take their spells into account. But that's exactly where the difficulty lies. Assigning spells some form of value is really campaign dependant, and some form of consensus can only be reached after serious playtesting.

That said, in the campaigns I have run I have found that powers can be super easy to tweak if they get out of hand, simply by messing around with augmentation costs. For example, energy missile's save DC increase should clearly go up 1 for every 2 pp spent, just like everything else in the XPH. To me, that's clearly just errata that hasn't made print yet.

Similarly, if the Expanded Knowledge feat is generating too much abuse, scratch out the line that says you can take it multiple times to pick up different powers. Then the decision becomes something more along the lines of "Should I take this at 5th for energy missile, or wait until 12th for psionic teleport?"

What I really like most about the psionic system is arguably the flavor text. Mindwipe temporarily erasing memories and abilities just reads way cooler than enervation, even though it does pretty much the same thing. But I also realize that if powers were simply renamed and reflavoured spells, most folks would simply say, "What's the point?" and would feel somewhat cheated for shelling out good $$$ for the book. As it stands now, far from being perfect, I do find using the XPH rather fun.

Cheers,
Vurt