Forced movement into a Zone

[Rafe]

Can a creature be force moved (pull, push, slide) into a damaging zone? For instance:

I cast Freezing Cloud and 3 enemies within the burst 2 suffer the effects (1d8 + 6 for me). They come out of it on their turn (taking 1d8 + 6 damage for starting there). On my turn, I use Thunderwave and blast them two squares (my Wis mod) back in.

Do they suffer the effects of entering Freezing Cloud via being pushed there (i.e., another 1d8 + 6 damage for "entering" the effect, plus another 1d8 + 6 damage on their turn for starting there)?

I'm thinking yes, but one would have to time it well and be positioned correctly.

 

[Raunalyn]

I believe the official ruling is that when being pushed into a zone by another power, they get a save to end the effect. I could be wrong, though

 

[Rafe]

I believe the official ruling is that when being pushed into a zone by another power, they get a save to end the effect. I could be wrong, though

Freezing Cloud does not deal static ongoing damage, though. It's just a damage roll (1d8 + bonuses). There is no save. Could you post the page reference, though? (if you find it)

 

[James McMurray]

The save is to fall prone rather than be pushed in, not to end the effect of the zone.

 

[Rafe]

I think you guys are thinking of Icy Terrain, which causes a target to fall prone on a successful hit. Freezing Cloud is just a damage roll with the spell having a duration of "until the end of your next turn."

 

[frankthedm]

I think you guys are thinking of Icy Terrain, which causes a target to fall prone on a successful hit. Freezing Cloud is just a damage roll with the spell having a duration of "until the end of your next turn."

"The Save or fall prone outside the effect" they are referring to is a section in the DMG. That section basically says if forced movement wound send someone into a dangerous square, the victim gets a save to instead fall prone before they enter the dangerous square. If that sounds nerf-rific to you, you are not alone.

 

[Rafe]

"The Save or fall prone outside the effect" they are referring to is a section in the DMG. That section basically says if forced movement wound send someone into a dangerous square, the victim gets a save to instead fall prone before they enter the dangerous square. If that sounds nerf-rific to you, you are not alone.

Found it. P. 44 of the DMG, re: forcing movement into challenging or dangerous terrain: "The creature makes a saving throw rolled immediately before entering the unsafe square, with success leaving the creature prone at the edge [of said difficult/dangerous terrain/zone]."

Second column, second paragraph.

 

[keterys]

It then becomes a question of whether zones count as terrain at all, and it's a very murky area of the rules at the moment.

 

[Caliban]

It then becomes a question of whether zones count as terrain at all, and it's a very murky area of the rules at the moment.

I don't believe they are, or it would have been mentioned in the PHB under the forced movement section, or the powers section under Zones. Or somewherein the PHB, if that rule was intended to be used for player powers.

In my opinion, that section of the DMG is for terrain hazards, not effects created by powers.

 

[keterys]

That is certainly one view, and a common one, yes. It's also common for DMs to rule that everyone gets a save when forced into dangerous areas.

It is interesting that an area of magical whirling blades set up as hazardous terrain of the area, but with all of the rules for blade barrier, would give a save, but blade barrier would not...

Given that the PHB does explicitly mention getting a save for pits and such, it seems likely they actually changed the rule between the PH/DMG team at some point and didn't reach an accord. Either way, I think clarification (FAQ, errata, whatever) would be good.