Desdichado
Hero
There's a reason I actually do much more of my gaming discussion at Circvs Maximvs these days.
Forked Thread: "The Death of the Imagination" re: World of Warcraft
- Thread starter Mercurius
- Start date
There's a reason I actually do much more of my gaming discussion at Circvs Maximvs these days.
Who cares wether or not he insulted the game or the players or some random passerby on the street who got caught in the crossfire.
I've not heard anything convincing me as to why WoW is slowly killing my imagination. I saw a comparison to smoking and lung cancer, but an addicting habit that kills thousands of people a day isn't exactly on par with WoW. I think they managed a good 4 or 5 asian players who died due to malnutrition and starvation playing like 3 days straight or something.
Not having any reason to believe what the OP said is correct, i'm having a difficult time being insulted. I'd compare it to a blind fellow insulting my outfit.
I've met alot of WoW players who I've seen take something from the game and create something of their own out of it. Stories, artwork, signatures, I myself have been inspired for adventure ideas by something in WoW that sparked my *gasp* imagination!
I've also met dumb, dumb, I mean really dumb WoW players. (Mostly in a battleground) Who, if imagination walked up and hit them in the face with a tack hammer, its a wasted effort. Here's the twist, you could put these people in any imagination cultivating situation, and they wouldn't get a single iota (such a cool word) of creativity from it.
I've also met really really dumb roleplayers, this will hurt people feelings i'm sure, but I really I can't stand the munchkin who is simply a ball of stats and dice rolls without any character story, personality, motivation, and so on. I don't think that person has any imagination at all. They are just playing a boardgame most efficiently, story doesn't matter to them.
But "death of the imagination"? My imagination was originally sparked by GI Joe, He-Man, D&D (started playing when I was 5) reading books, and cinema. Are you trying to tell me through my actions now that the endless fount of creativity pouring out of my brain all day will just die because I play a video game?
So, all in all, wasted post. You show no reason to support that WoW does anythign to the imagination, I've clearly seen several cases it improves it, and I don't believe imagination is capable of dying to begin with.
And i'm not insulted that you said that about the game or the players or whatever, again, blind man telling me I painted my bedroom the wrong color.
I've not heard anything convincing me as to why WoW is slowly killing my imagination. I saw a comparison to smoking and lung cancer, but an addicting habit that kills thousands of people a day isn't exactly on par with WoW. I think they managed a good 4 or 5 asian players who died due to malnutrition and starvation playing like 3 days straight or something.
Not having any reason to believe what the OP said is correct, i'm having a difficult time being insulted. I'd compare it to a blind fellow insulting my outfit.
I've met alot of WoW players who I've seen take something from the game and create something of their own out of it. Stories, artwork, signatures, I myself have been inspired for adventure ideas by something in WoW that sparked my *gasp* imagination!
I've also met dumb, dumb, I mean really dumb WoW players. (Mostly in a battleground) Who, if imagination walked up and hit them in the face with a tack hammer, its a wasted effort. Here's the twist, you could put these people in any imagination cultivating situation, and they wouldn't get a single iota (such a cool word) of creativity from it.
I've also met really really dumb roleplayers, this will hurt people feelings i'm sure, but I really I can't stand the munchkin who is simply a ball of stats and dice rolls without any character story, personality, motivation, and so on. I don't think that person has any imagination at all. They are just playing a boardgame most efficiently, story doesn't matter to them.
But "death of the imagination"? My imagination was originally sparked by GI Joe, He-Man, D&D (started playing when I was 5) reading books, and cinema. Are you trying to tell me through my actions now that the endless fount of creativity pouring out of my brain all day will just die because I play a video game?
So, all in all, wasted post. You show no reason to support that WoW does anythign to the imagination, I've clearly seen several cases it improves it, and I don't believe imagination is capable of dying to begin with.
And i'm not insulted that you said that about the game or the players or whatever, again, blind man telling me I painted my bedroom the wrong color.
But they like meanness, so now what do I do, I'm all confused on how I should approach them now.
Desdichado
Hero
www.circvsmaximvs.com
It's a fun place. Granted, because of the smaller volume, certain types of discussion doesn't get as much attention as it would here.
However, I find that the quality of the discussion is very high, and most of the posters there are also ENW posters. The place is pretty much unmoderated, but that doesn't mean that it's as wild and wooly as the "glory days" of Usenet or anything; it actually tends to be pretty well self-policed.
It's a fun place. Granted, because of the smaller volume, certain types of discussion doesn't get as much attention as it would here.
However, I find that the quality of the discussion is very high, and most of the posters there are also ENW posters. The place is pretty much unmoderated, but that doesn't mean that it's as wild and wooly as the "glory days" of Usenet or anything; it actually tends to be pretty well self-policed.
Get all up in their face, red-faced and screaming, waving hands wildly, spittle flying from the mouth, and then walk away without hitting them.
It's terribly frustrating for a masochist, like getting to second base and getting shut down and having to go home and take a cold shower.
Rel
Liquid Awesome
I think you'd fare better there than here, Steely Dan. And I don't mean that as an insult. I also do a lot of my gaming discussion there.
Just as one more anecdotal reference (since it seems all the rage) I only started playing WoW about a year ago. I did so while I was in the midst of running a Warhammer FRP game that combined the world of Warhammer with Pirates of the Caribbean. It was probably one of the most creative and successful games I've ever run (and trust me, I'm hella creative and successful most of the time). I noticed no qualitative difference in my ability to GM before and after starting to play WoW.*
So either WoW has no universal effect on supressing imagination OR I'm just so awesome that I overcame it with ease. I'm willing to accept either explanation.
*What I DID notice was that we spent our social time before and after the game talking more about WoW and less about sports and women. Maybe WoW suppresses interest in sports and women?! :gasp:
WizarDru
Adventurer
Mercurius said:
Interesting. So, in your opinion, imagination has to be graded on a curve? And some uses of imagination are better than others?
So, when a WoW fan writes a program to help him and others achieve a goal in a game like WoW (be it a voice chat program, mapping program or screenshot taker)...that's not using 'good' imagination? You contend that fan fiction and fan art, whether it be Dr. Who, Star Wars or World of Warcraft is 'low' imagination? The person who creates a fan website, possibly with quest information or roleplaying forums isn't really being imaginative at all...at least not in any way that you consider meaningful? When someone created the "I Am Murloc" music video, how do you quantify that act on your 'imagination scale'?
As someone pointed out above, how is a person writing a fan-fiction or doing fan-art any more or less creative than a DM writing a module or a player making a sketch of his character? Both are constrained by an existing framework and existing history and visual elements. Considering many of the fan works end up being co-opted by the creators, clearly they don't agree with your assessment.
What is an example of 'higher' imagination on your scale, exactly?
Puggins
Explorer
Your conjecture is speculative, groundless and, in fact, flies in the face of quite a few studies which conclude that interactive video games are nothing like television in terms of suppressing or altering a human's thought process or brain patterns. See this site, for example, which claims that children's imaginations are in fact stimulated by video games.
Why are your opposite assertions not quite supportable? Well, that's simple- you are merely re-drawing a line in the sand in terms of stimulus. You claim that WoW suppresses imagination by feeding users stimuli that they might otherwise have to provide themselves. This is also true of books (which provide stories which readers which readers would also have to provide), plays (which provides visual stimulus, just like warcraft) and RPGs (the DM feeds you a story that you would otherwise have to provide yourself). The fact that you draw your line at MMORPGs rather than RPGs or even farther back is simply a function of your own personal preferences- your parents or friends might have drawn it at RPGs, and you would, of course, disagree.
Now, you're right that television has been found to suppress neural activity. But there is a fundamental difference between television and computer games- computer games like WoW demand that you interact with the external world. You must reason, interact and generally remain active while playing good video games, something that television simply doesn't permit. The results are documented and verifiable- television suppresses brain development, video games actually promote it.
So please, don't try to justify your distaste for WoW by making groundless assertions of imminent cultural loss of imagination. You don't like WoW- fine. That certainly doesn't make you smarter, more imaginative or better adjsuted than the folks who enjoy it.
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