TroyXavier
First Post
I like the number of deities. Also there's not that many major deities(30..2 of which are drow).
FR gods, too many?
- Thread starter Clumsy Bob
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Mystery Man
First Post
Yes, I only focus on a few at any given time if at all it's nice to have some obscure, out-of-the-way god to have pulling somebodys strings though. The rest are there for the players to enjoy, mostly ignored by me unless it helps push the campaign along.
Davelozzi
Explorer
Yeah, I think they are too many gods in the Fearunian pantheon. And it was better in the old grey box days, there has been a creeping increase in the numbers since then. For me, I knew it had gone too far when Finder Wyvernspur became a god.
I have no problem with the other pantheons being worshipped in the Realms. Have all the gods you want if it's a cultural issue, but the Faerunian pantheon is just a bunch of divine soup.
I have no problem with the other pantheons being worshipped in the Realms. Have all the gods you want if it's a cultural issue, but the Faerunian pantheon is just a bunch of divine soup.
Oni
First Post
Personally I think most campaign worlds have too few gods. One pantheon for a whole campaign world seems a little odd to me, too homogenous. I like it to very regional, it seems more realistic to me (and while I recognize fantasy need not be realistic, it doesn't hurt to have a grounding in reality).
Henry
Autoexreginated
Just take one pantheon from our real Earth - the Greek.
Aphrodite, Apollo, Ares, Artemis, Athene, Demeter, Dionysos, Hades, Hecate, Hephaistos, Hera, Hermes, Hestia, Persephone, Poseidon, and Zeus. That's not counting other beings that were either formerly worshipped (The Titans such as Chronos, Gaia, Uranus, et. al.) or who were later ascended to divinity (Herakles, Achilles, etc.) Count up the number of beings worshipped as Divine in the Greek pantheon, and you'll come up with well in excess of 50 to 75.
All things considered, the FR pantheons have too FEW, not too many. We've just been spoiled by Monotheism.
Aphrodite, Apollo, Ares, Artemis, Athene, Demeter, Dionysos, Hades, Hecate, Hephaistos, Hera, Hermes, Hestia, Persephone, Poseidon, and Zeus. That's not counting other beings that were either formerly worshipped (The Titans such as Chronos, Gaia, Uranus, et. al.) or who were later ascended to divinity (Herakles, Achilles, etc.) Count up the number of beings worshipped as Divine in the Greek pantheon, and you'll come up with well in excess of 50 to 75.
All things considered, the FR pantheons have too FEW, not too many. We've just been spoiled by Monotheism.
BrooklynKnight
First Post
Agreed. I like the diversity in FR.
AFGNCAAP
First Post
In a word: Yes!
To expand on that word:
IMHO, FR is the best example of a bad practice in D&D--an immense amount of detail & variety in human cultures (while lumping all varieties of humans under 1 stat set), while underdeveloping the various demihuman cultures (though all of their various/major cultures are depicted via different stat sets--drow elves, gray elves, high elves, wood elves, wild elves, etc.). One of the elements of this is providing a plethora of different culturally-based human pantheons, yet having only 1 or 2 pantheons for each demihuman race.
IMHO, I think the existence of the multiple pantheons is more or less for accomodating players. Want to be a pseudo-Egyptian like cleric? Here's the Mulhorandi pantheon to pick from! Want to be a LN cleric of war, but not follow the CN god Tempus? Here's the Red Knight!
I have to agree that there is a huge amount of redundancy, and that some areas really do need to be covered. However, I also think that areas could be trimmed as well by reducing the number of deities who basically have the same pantheons. I also think that the pantheons need to be less D&D-centric--there should be gods of fertility, harvest, love, & other major aspects of life, and less deities of character classes, character races, or other game-mechanic-related faiths, if you will.
Simply put, I think that there should basically be 1 deity per portfolio. I think that clerics, druids, & other PC "priest" classes should cover the major/dominant deities, while the adept NPC class could cover tightly-focused aspect deities/demi-deities/spirits (like gods of particularly-aligned PC classes, specific locales/nations, etc.), worshipping outsiders (like angels & daemons), as well as "fallen" deities who've lost most of their faithful (Moander, for example). These deities (whose existence is fact in the setting) may have different names, titles, &/or appearances to faithful from different cultures (for example, Tempus could be known as Anhur by the Mulhorandi & Clangeddin by the dwarves).
To expand on that word:
IMHO, FR is the best example of a bad practice in D&D--an immense amount of detail & variety in human cultures (while lumping all varieties of humans under 1 stat set), while underdeveloping the various demihuman cultures (though all of their various/major cultures are depicted via different stat sets--drow elves, gray elves, high elves, wood elves, wild elves, etc.). One of the elements of this is providing a plethora of different culturally-based human pantheons, yet having only 1 or 2 pantheons for each demihuman race.
IMHO, I think the existence of the multiple pantheons is more or less for accomodating players. Want to be a pseudo-Egyptian like cleric? Here's the Mulhorandi pantheon to pick from! Want to be a LN cleric of war, but not follow the CN god Tempus? Here's the Red Knight!
I have to agree that there is a huge amount of redundancy, and that some areas really do need to be covered. However, I also think that areas could be trimmed as well by reducing the number of deities who basically have the same pantheons. I also think that the pantheons need to be less D&D-centric--there should be gods of fertility, harvest, love, & other major aspects of life, and less deities of character classes, character races, or other game-mechanic-related faiths, if you will.
Simply put, I think that there should basically be 1 deity per portfolio. I think that clerics, druids, & other PC "priest" classes should cover the major/dominant deities, while the adept NPC class could cover tightly-focused aspect deities/demi-deities/spirits (like gods of particularly-aligned PC classes, specific locales/nations, etc.), worshipping outsiders (like angels & daemons), as well as "fallen" deities who've lost most of their faithful (Moander, for example). These deities (whose existence is fact in the setting) may have different names, titles, &/or appearances to faithful from different cultures (for example, Tempus could be known as Anhur by the Mulhorandi & Clangeddin by the dwarves).
Desdichado
Hero
Does the Forgotten Realms have to many xxxx? Short answer: yes! FR has too much of everything! Too many races, too many prestige classes, too many exotic things going on all over the place. That's a hallmark of the setting, and one of the reasons it's fans like it.
In fact, I think your specific answer to the xxxx above, the amount of gods, is one of the few areas in which too many is not a problem. You an always have more god options. I actually really like the faen from AU that run around inventing gods on the spot to worship, and take the whole thing rather seriously.
In fact, I think your specific answer to the xxxx above, the amount of gods, is one of the few areas in which too many is not a problem. You an always have more god options. I actually really like the faen from AU that run around inventing gods on the spot to worship, and take the whole thing rather seriously.
AFGNCAAP
First Post
I humbly disagree. First, despite the large numbers of deities in mythology, how many of them were actively & frequently worshipped? Though these deities may have been placated in particular times of need, I don't think each individual one would have had its own church & dogma associated with it. In D&D terms, I'd think that a majority of the deities, especially the lesser ones, would have the adept NPC class for their priesthood, while the major deities would actually have the PC priest classes for their priesthood.
Also, I think there's a big clash between reality vs. fantasy here. While it may be more realistic to have large number of deities, it contradicts the key presumption of D&D/fantasy where the deities are real, take direct interest in the affairs of mortals, & can shape the way the world evolves via their portfolio.
Besides, another thing to keep in mind is that more often than not, ancient cultures often equated deities of other pantheons with their own. Donar/Thor was just another name/depiction of Jove to the Romans. The Greeks saw Set is the Egyptian's version of Typhon. This is one thing where I think modern monotheism has distorted our view--where the ancients may have seen the various storm-gods as different interpretations of the same thing/being, some modern religions are more absolute (you're/it's either X or not).
Thus, IMHO, I'd think it'd be much more accurate if, for example, the Faerunians saw the deity of magic as Mystra, while the Mulhorandi saw the deity of magic as Isis, while the elves may see the deity of magic as Corellon. Instead, it seems that D&D uses the concept of polytheism, yet interprets the faiths of these polytheistic deities through a more modern, monotheistic lens.
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