From the Rules of the Game:All About Grappling (Part One):

[Egres]

From the Rules of the Game:All About Grappling (Part One) article:


You share your foe's space when you're grappling. If you and your foe are different sizes, use the larger of the two space entries. Any attack that can reach the shared space can hit you. You don't get cover from a foe you're grappling, but any attack aimed into your shared space has an equal chance to strike you or the creature you're grappling. Roll randomly to determine which creature an attack strikes (see note 3 on Table 8-6 in the Player's Handbook). If you use a weapon against a foe you're grappling (see Part Two), you don't have to roll to determine the target you actually attack.

What?

Wasn't the random roll limited to ranged attacks only?

 

[Scharlata]

Wasn't the random roll limited to ranged attacks only?

Hi!

Footnote 3 of the Table 8-6, page 151 PHB, indicates that, yes.

IMHO, it would make sense that melee attacks also were affected. Just my PoV.

Kind regards

 

[shilsen]

Yes, it's just ranged weapons. Many people have argued that it should apply to melee weapons too, as Scharlata does above, but I'm personally fine with it as it is. Makes it easier to sneak attack someone when an ally grapples him

 

[Pinotage]

I'm so glad they finally decided to do grappling. Now I only hope they sort out the Improved Grab, monster natural attacks and BAB issue so we can run things properly!

Pinotage

 

[sierzadon]

More random = more dangerous

Each random element in the game makes it more dangerous for the PCs. As the rules of the game are now written, it is more dangerous for the PCs for any game that adheres to the rules of the game in favour of the PHB.

 

[Telas]

Grappling Rant

Grappling has always been a rough patch in the D&D rules. Since learning how to grapple (in real life), it's even more annoying. Any clarification or simplification is appreciated, and I'm looking forward to the rest of the columns.

I agree that you should be able to melee attack into a Grapple without the 50% fratricide rule. I also think that the Precise Shot feat should ignore (or minimize) the fratricide rule.

For what it's worth, I don't have a house rule for Grappling (yet), but I have a plan for a flowchart simplifying Grapples. It's somewhere on the back burner next to last week's spaghetti.

Again, for what it's worth, I'm suspecting any house rules will be pretty simple:
(Sorry if this isn't the right place.)
1) Pins last until broken, not just for one round. Yep, this is huge.
2) Getting Pinned gives you a penalty for Grappling until you break the pin. I'm thinking about a -4 penalty to all Grapple checks. As it is, getting Pinned is little more than another layer of getting Grappled. Having been put into any number of locks, pins, or submission positions, I can say that it's much, much worse.
3) Pinning your opponent allows a Grappler to take the combat to the ground (Prone) as part of the maneuver. Grapples that last 8 rounds without going Prone are incredibly unrealistic. As a corrolary, being Prone does not penalize the Grappling checks (although all other normal penalties apply).

These have not been tested, but are where I'm headed with Grappling. Comments? Questions? Gripes?

Telas

(Preview Post doesn't seem to be working; sorry for any formatting or spelling errors.)

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

2) Getting Pinned gives you a penalty for Grappling until you break the pin. As it is, getting Pinned is little more than another layer of getting Grappled. Having been put into any number of locks, pins, or submission positions, I can say that it's much, much worse.

D&D tends to try to avoid any rules that could be rewritten as, "If you get screwed, you get really screwed."

In other words, getting pinned is a pretty hefty penalty in and of itself. Getting pinned and then it being even harder to get out of it is an even bigger penalty.

The main problem, of course, is that unless you are specifically built as a grappling machine, anything with even a modicum of grappling skill is likely to easily win any and all grappling checks against you - adding additional penalties is probably not required.

 

[Destan]

Grappling Basics on WotC Site - Incorrect?

On the WotC site:

"You share your foe's space when you're grappling. If you and your foe are different sizes, use the larger of the two space entries. Any attack that can reach the shared space can hit you. You don't get cover from a foe you're grappling, but any attack aimed into your shared space has an equal chance to strike you or the creature you're grappling. Roll randomly to determine which creature an attack strikes (see note 3 on Table 8-6 in the Player's Handbook)."

Emphasis mine.

This is only partially true, no? I thought the chance to hit anyone involved in a grapple only applied to ranged attacks? This is supported in the SRD.

Do the rules now say any attacks (e.g., melee attacks) have a similar chance to hit anyone involved in the grapple?

D

 

[scrubkai]

See the other thread

This is already under discussion in another thread.

See here http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=122825

 

[The_Universe]

Sounds right to me, Destan.

I think it's only for ranged attacks.

Anybody else with a more definitive answer?