Goblin Hexer - Errata? Or just OP?

[the Jester]

I'm sorry, 25% harder to hit someone you're figthing when you're blindfolded and they're not? Did the game designers even think this through, at all?

You're not seriously trying to apply real-world reasoning to D&D, are you?

4e explicitly dispenses with much of any sense of in-game realism in favor of game mechanics that promote fun. Making blinded any worse than it is would take away from this.

Keep in mind, too, that a blinded adventurer is much more practiced at combat, adventuring issues, etc than you or I would be. Imagine trying to do one of your everyday activities with a moderately thick blindfold on- you could prolly manage it, more or less.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

if all your senses are muted, you're deaf and dumb, basically helpless.

That's how I'd rule it. 4e's "blind but not blind" is just too dumb for me to handle. I'd rather the condition weren't even there to be honest. It can target your square (where it knew you were last) but can't shift either, and if it tries to move more than 2 squares will run right into a wall. Ever watch a blind person cross the street? Now imagine hitting him. Or a gang taunting him and poking at him. Not a nice picture, granted, but let's drop this silliness already. If you're blind you should grant a LOT more than combat advantage and take a lot more than -2/-5 to hit.

I'm sorry, 25% harder to hit someone you're figthing when you're blindfolded and they're not? Did the game designers even think this through, at all?

Yeah, just look at my previous post. They DID think it through quite thoroghly, and as the Jester also stated, they decided that the choice was between something that A) basically forces the player to meta-game and will never come up because it is effectively 'your as good as dead', or B) something that is unrealistic but is playable and gives you the flavor of being blind without being a useless status effect. I at least am not disagreeing with you that someone who's BLIND (and not just 'I got sand in my eyes') realistically can't fight effectively at all, etc. Also, remember, the blindness you get hit with in 4e combat lasts maybe 20-30 seconds at most, so it doesn't strain credulity TOO much to imagine the character manages to stumble around for a couple rounds and may even get in a shot or two. If a PC were say blinded for a long time and expected to travel, explore, etc without help, then it becomes a story consideration and falls outside of the combat rules. At that point I might well decide to drive home the sheer desperation of the situation where the character is lost in utter darkness in a strange dungeon.

 

[Ninja-to]

This turned into quite the discussion.

In terms of the Monster Vault 'errata' on the Hexer, you're right the nerf is kinda minimal. I suppose the 'end of turn' guarantees a 'save' instead. But if the Hexer focused fire on a target he could pretty much shut down a warlock or non-aoe specced wizard. Strangely enough, the Hexer from the little encounter in the Forgotten Realms Campaign book shut down the fighter in the party, removing the chance to place marks on the mobs that were swarming the rest of the party (IIRC). The player looked at me wide-eyed when I told him the ability was 'At-Will'.

It's ok though. I think I like these little guys just the way they are muhahah

 

[Aegeri]

A fighter applies a mark regardless of if he hits or misses, plus can pick up some excellent close burst powers that ignore blind entirely. Now a Knight, a Knight you have to feel sorry for as once blind a creature can freely move away and know it won't carry any mark penalty with it (his punishment triggers on shifting, not moving - an important distinction). The Knight also lacks any flexibility in powers (especially in heroic tier) that the Fighter has.

 

[Neonchameleon]

The MV hexer is actually nerfed I think - its cloud isn't half as obnoxious. But weakly nerfed otherwise if at all.

 

[Stalker0]

I think the best way to think of 4e blindness is legally blind instead of completely blind....kind of like the old throw sand in your eye trick.

I have a friend who is legally blind, and she even has a guide dog. But you can see colors and shapes even though they are extrememly blurry. She can get around her house without too much trouble, and can see a person moving around, but she could never drive a car.

 

[Ninja-to]

Quick question. With the Vexing Cloud (the old version), is the -2 penatly to attacks *in addition* to the -2 penalty to attacks from being concealed, so a total of -4?

 

[Destil]

Quick question. With the Vexing Cloud (the old version), is the -2 penatly to attacks *in addition* to the -2 penalty to attacks from being concealed, so a total of -4?

Depends. The cloud makes the hexer's enemies within it suffer a -2 to attack.

It also grants concealment to him and his allies while within it.

So attacking into the cloud from outside or out of it from inside: -2.
Attacking into the cloud from inside: -4.

One's concealment and one's an attack penalty, should that matter. So other attack penalties will stack if they come up, but creatures can only benefit from concealment once, and they don't get any benefits if totally concealed (because the total concealment would override it).

 

[Ninja-to]

Hm alright cool thanks. A bit confusing though it sorta makes sense.