Good Superhero-Game?

[Agamon]

Thanks, Tietan ... you reminded me of another criticism of M&M that I'd meant to respond to in the earlier post. It is absolutely easy to make a skill-based super in that game. In fact, the core rules provide 13 samples of character example types, of which 4 have no "powers" outside of those possessed by their Devices and Equipment, 5 if you count the Battlesuit example.

Um...and that's a bad thing?

 

[Thotas]

Nope, I'm an M&M booster. An earlier poster said M&M didn't do skill based heroes well; I'm pointing out that 4 or 5 of the examples given in the rules are characters with no Powers. And that's a high rate if the M&M basher were correct about that. I'm say it's good.

 

[The Grackle]

Uhhh, no, you are soooooo wrong. Highly skilled characters were EASY to make. You took super-attributes and flawed them to skills only because Super-atts added to your skill level and then all you had to do was put a couple points in trained only skills, even just 1. All of a sudden you had a guy with MAD skills and much cheaper than ANY of the supposed fixes the community came up with. You had to go all the way to 1 power point equals 4 skill points for the fix to work. In 2e that is the exchange rate for PP and SP. You could put ten points in skills now and get a GREAT highly trained character at PL 10.

Jason

Yeah, 1e M&M got some criticism for it's lack of focus on skill-type characters, and fixes like this. "I don't want a guy who's good at all INT skills! I want a guy who builds robots! Just RObots!!" But that's gone the way of the dodo. Skillful characters are super easy to make. & b/c skills are cheaper in 2e, you don't see PCs ignoring them in favor of spending pps only on powers. It only costs a few points to round out even the most focused/one sided characters.

 

[Felon]

Here's another M&M question: as I understand it, there's "equipment" that's free and "devices" that you pay for, and the line between the two is somewhat aribtrary.

So, if I'm playing a martial artist archetype, is there any reason why I wouldn't augment my attacks with, say, a mundane (i.e. free) pair of nunchaku? Is there a mechanical balance between an armed and unarmed martial artist? Does it cost any PP to learn to use weapons?

 

[Thotas]

Equipment isn't free.

The game descriptive diff between equipment and a device is that I, Thotas, can (if I have the cash) buy equipment. Not legally in the case of some items, but it's stuff a person in real life could theoretically have. On the other hand, Iron Man armor and Mjolnir are off limits even to Bill Gates. As such, and the fact that they're one of a kind, makes them Devices.

In terms of the game mechanics, Equipment is a Feat (and can be swapped for equipment of equal value when the GM determines you've got the opportunity). Device is a Power.

Both cost points in your build.

 

[Aaron L]

Pity... (especially since GURPS 4e might actually work for this sort of campaign, unlike 3e)


But I'll just add to the chorus of Mutants & Masterminds fans instead. I will get to play in a campaign starting tomorrow. The other characters are:

- A human transformed into a being of pure light.
- A woman with control over darkness.
- The H4 Chronometer.

Me? I'm playing a human who got mind-switched into a Formless Spawn...

Jurgen, Ive never played GURPS, But Id love to play a supers game with you

 

[Kanegrundar]

Just adding to the chours of M&M 2E love. It's the best supers game I've ever played.

However, if you don't like M&M 2E, HERO 5th Edition is good, just don't let the HUGE rulebook scare you. I also have a soft spot for the old Marvel Superheroes RPG. FASERIP is still embedded in my consciousness.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Felon
Meh. Hate to sound like an apostate, but I'd say avoid it if the above is of interest to you. HERO provides a lot of theoretical options, but the point costs often thwart ambitious, interesting character designs in lieu of designing a straighforward powerhouse.

Once again, my experience differs. I have HERO PCs who are powerhouses, and I have others who are not, like Seeker, whose powers were all about having extremely powerful perception abilities: X-ray visions, blindsight, etc., and had only a modicum of combat ability...not even enough that he could take down a black belt with any sense of certainty...or Dreadnought, the "invulnerable" PI with some base-level martial arts (boxing) and a Desert Eagle as his only offense.

 

[Drowbane]

eye-twitch

I can't believe I'm the only person who likes Champions: New Millenium. It is the Fuzion version of Champions that doesn't suck the way Fuzion Bubble Gum Crisis did.

It's a relatively quick and simple system with a lot of flexibility to it. The rules are coherent and the mechanics are straightforward. It isn't quite as granular as HeroSystem (but criminy, what is?) but comes pretty darn close. There are some fuzion-licensed add-ons for magic & more advanced power rules that gives it nearly as much crunch without the brain-bending math. It has its own "CR" system which basically uses the HeroSystem OCV/DCV as guides for character balance.

Eh, why not bring up "Foundation" while you're at it....

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I bought Foundation when it came out.

I read those rules...

Sir, Fuzion was no Foundation!