D&D 5E Greater Invis and Stealth checks, how do you rule it?

[Hriston]

Distance is left up to the DM. I use the variable audible distances from, I think, the first DM screen, so for this situation where the monk isn't trying to stay quiet (because not taking the Hide action), I'd roll 2d6 and multiply by 10 for the number of feet normal noise carries. Usually 100 feet is going to be out of hearing range unless the noise the monk is making is very loud, so an observer will have heard the monk moving in whatever direction, but will have lost the ability to pinpoint the monk's location at around 70 feet, but there's a chance the noise could carry as far as 120 feet.

 

[Oofta]

There must be some sort of distance rules for this. I would think that an invisible PC that moves 100 feet away is harder to detect than than someone that moved 15ft or 30ft. I get the part with detecting clues that someone is invisible near you and getting the basic direction of moving 'that way'. In a normal environment, or a combat, the sights or noise will drown out at some point.

I can see eyes of the eagle negating the disadvantage to perceive the invisible person at a distance.

What's the environment? Jungle? Frozen over lake? Bustling city? What style of game are you running? Anime style, wuxia, semi-realistic? Is the person you're trying to spot small? Large? Flying?

All of those things are going to factor in so it's up to the DM who has hopefully discussed all of this with their players.

 

[Dausuul]

To step away from rules for just a second - the entire round of everyone acting is about 6 seconds. So, this character is running a hundred feet in a second or two.

So your position is that the length of an individual combatant's turn equals (6 seconds / number of combatants)? A normal person, moving 30 feet in a round, can accelerate to 100 miles per hour simply by getting into a 30-person brawl? A large battle allows you to reach escape velocity on foot?

This isn't stepping away from rules, it's embracing the rules and stepping away from sanity.

 

[Umbran]

So your position is that the length of an individual combatant's turn equals (6 seconds / number of combatants)? A normal person, moving 30 feet in a round, can accelerate to 100 miles per hour simply by getting into a 30-person brawl? A large battle allows you to reach escape velocity on foot?

Dude, you're the one taking a general point and applying it to a specific extreme example as if that's reasonable. Heck, as a GM, if you are rolling 30 individual initiative counts (instead of saying," Okay, the goblins all go now, the orcs will go on 12, and the ogre goes on 6..."), then you're not in a position to question the sensibility of my description.

 

[Dausuul]

Dude, you're the one taking a general point and applying it to a specific extreme example as if that's reasonable. Heck, as a GM, if you are rolling 30 individual initiative counts (instead of saying," Okay, the goblins all go now"), then you're not in a position to question the sensibility of my description.

You claimed that the monk's movement takes place in "a second or two," even though a round is 6 seconds long. It appeared that you were basing that statement on dividing the length of a round by the number of combatants. Is that, in fact, what you are doing? If not, what are you doing?

 

[DEFCON 1]

You claimed that the monk's movement takes place in "a second or two," even though a round is 6 seconds long. It appeared that you were basing that statement on dividing the length of a round by the number of combatants. Is that, in fact, what you are doing? If not, what are you doing?

I suspect that when he said and italicized 'everyone', it wasn't to relate the 1 or 2 seconds to the entire group of combatants each getting only a piece of those 6 seconds... I think he was saying that because everyone was using the exact same 6 seconds to act, the Monk is using 1 or 2 seconds to run up to his enemy, a couple seconds to make his attacks, and then 1 or 2 seconds to run away (thus equivilating moving 100 feet in 1 or 2 seconds to being Usain Bolt.) And because the enemy would be also be acting in those same 6 seconds... the enemy on its turn could easily move 60 feet in the same direction the Monk went.

Which means the enemy would be only 40 feet away from the Monk at the end of those 6 seconds and thus the idea that it could hear the Monk and know where it was after all that running wasn't out of the question.

Maybe I'm mistaken on what @Umbran was saying, but that's what I got from it.

 

[Flamestrike]

If you take an action to hide, you are hidden until your next turn.

Not true.

If you take an action to Hide (and succeed) you remain hidden indefinitely until you either reveal yourself somehow (such as by making an attack) or your opponent uses the Search action to find you (and succeeds).

 

[Ovinomancer]

The GM decides. That's it. Make a ruling, and be consistent.

In this case, the GM needs to decide if the current environment is sufficient so that the GM rules that perception checks to notice the monk automatically fail. This is part of the core play loop, and nothing about being in combat removes this choice from the GM -- combat just provided more tools to adjudicate uncertainty and more guidance on what to consider uncertain. If the terrain is such that moving 100ft. away would reasonably mean that no one can see where you are or where you went (at least towards the end), then that qualifies as Hidden because it meets the definition. However, you also need to consider that the situation might change (the monk's foes could move towards where the monk ran off and get much closer to the monk) and make changes to your adjudication of the situation. There's no wrong answer, here. Guidance from the rules suggests that you normally are not Hidden unless you take an action. Guidance doesn't know your situation, though, so start biased towards the guidance but rule according to your situation.

 

[Flamestrike]

The GM decides. That's it. Make a ruling, and be consistent.

In this case, the GM needs to decide if the current environment is sufficient so that the GM rules that perception checks to notice the monk automatically fail. This is part of the core play loop, and nothing about being in combat removes this choice from the GM -- combat just provided more tools to adjudicate uncertainty and more guidance on what to consider uncertain. If the terrain is such that moving 100ft. away would reasonably mean that no one can see where you are or where you went (at least towards the end), then that qualifies as Hidden because it meets the definition. However, you also need to consider that the situation might change (the monk's foes could move towards where the monk ran off and get much closer to the monk) and make changes to your adjudication of the situation. There's no wrong answer, here. Guidance from the rules suggests that you normally are not Hidden unless you take an action. Guidance doesn't know your situation, though, so start biased towards the guidance but rule according to your situation.

You keep saying 'see' the monk. He's invisible.

You mean to say 'have a rough idea where the invisible Monk is by virtue of visual clues and sound made by the monk who is making no effort to mask either'

 

[Ovinomancer]

You keep saying 'see' the monk. He's invisible.

You mean to say 'have a rough idea where the invisible Monk is by virtue of visual clues and sound made by the monk who is making no effort to mask either'

No, I didn't. The only "see" in my post is a general statement about how ruling on Hidden works. Anyone, with any condition, that moves 100ft. away may qualify as Hidden if the situation and terrain suggest it is so. The Invisible Monk has an extra thing to consider, sure, but that schtick doesn't invalidate this statement. I said what I meant to say, thanks.