D&D (2024) Greyhawk Confirmed. Tell Me Why.

[Hussar]

It currently doesn't.
And there is no guarantee WOTC will update it.

That is 90% off the problem.

Greyhawk is freaking OLD.
To match 5th edition's mechanics, assumptions, and content, Greyhawk needs an update.

And there is no guarantee WOTC will update it.
A not-updated Greyhawk is a poor education material.
You would be forcing new DMs to do something with the knowledge to do it.

And here is the Catch-22

An updated Greyhawk has no charm. It's just Alt FR.

I disagree.

But to clarify, what do you believe needs to be updated in the setting? Races are the obvious one, but that’s not really much of a change. Tieflings come from Iuz. Dragonborn have always been around. Heck there’s lots of terra incognita in GH. Plonking a Dragonborn nation in the Hellfurnaces is easy.

What else?

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I know a lot of people didn't like Van Richten's Guide to Ravenloft

Which is fantastic, and by far my most used setting book.

 

[Minigiant]

I disagree.

But to clarify, what do you believe needs to be updated in the setting? Races are the obvious one, but that’s not really much of a change. Tieflings come from Iuz. Dragonborn have always been around. Heck there’s lots of terra incognita in GH. Plonking a Dragonborn nation in the Hellfurnaces is easy.

What else?

I listed it before.

Make it Heroic Fantasy
Make it High Magic
Remove all the SciFi, Western, and general non fantasy stuff
Inject currently popular themes
Explain how all the popular characters fit in the world
Explain the empty spaces

Basically a setting that matches the Players Handbook.

 

[Hussar]

I listed it before.

Make it Heroic Fantasy
Make it High Magic
Remove all the SciFi, Western, and general non fantasy stuff
Inject currently popular themes
Explain how all the popular characters fit in the world
Explain the empty spaces

Basically a setting that matches the Players Handbook.

Why would you need to do any of that?

Greyhawk is already 100% heroic fantasy. Or, perhaps we're having a communication failure? How do you define heroic fantasy?

Greyhawk was ALWAYS high magic. Very high magic. As in insanely high magic. This is a setting where wizards rained down the colorless fire and destroyed the continent. At no point was Greyhawk ever not high magic. Good grief, you have actual gods ruling countries in Greyhawk. The most famous dungeon in the land is the one where a wizard imprisoned multiple gods. In what way is Greyhawk low magic?

Why would you remove sci fi or western stuff?

What "popular themes" do you specifically have in mind?

What do you mean by "popular characters"?

 

[Minigiant]

Why would you need to do any of that?

To teach DMs how to play they game.

Greyhawk is already 100% heroic fantasy. Or, perhaps we're having a communication failure? How do you define heroic fantasy?

Greyhawk was ALWAYS high magic. Very high magic. As in insanely high magic. This is a setting where wizards rained down the colorless fire and destroyed the continent. At no point was Greyhawk ever not high magic.

Yeah. At High Level.

5e and the 2024 version will have players as big mall of world changing power and coursing with magic at level one.

Many races get spells.
Magic is a feat away
Most of the subclasses of no casters give magic or warp reality by level THREE.

PCs can slaughter evil humaniod scout parties without a sweat.

This warped the sensibilities and themes of zeroes becoming major forces later that most old setting ran on because they were built on 1e or 2e.

Why would you remove sci fi or western stuff?

Limiting info load on new players.

What "popular themes" do you specifically have in mind?

BBEGs meant to be defeated, NPC relationships, weaving personal side quests into the main plot.

What do you mean by "popular characters"?

The Archmages, liches, warrior kings, and wandering NPC parties.

 

[Remathilis]

To be fair, it is possible that those were three different groups of people. I mean, it is possible. Unlikely perhaps but possible.

I'm sure the Venn diagram overlaps more than it doesn't.

 

[TiQuinn]

Make it Heroic Fantasy

I’m sure it will be because 5e is heroic fantasy.

Make it High Magic

Greyhawk will also be high magic just as it always has been because D&D is a high magic system.

Remove all the SciFi, Western, and general non fantasy stuff

Interesting. This has always been part and parcel of Greyhawk, but I get it. Some people don’t like chocolate in their peanut butter.

Inject currently popular themes

I don’t know what that could mean, but how does it differ from any other setting’s themes. Do you have an example of a current popular theme that you think D&D doesn’t cover that fits for GH?

Explain how all the popular characters fit in the world

I mean - Circle of Eight? Powerful named wizards?

Explain the empty spaces

Empty spaces exist for a meta reason - it’s the unknown that the adventurers are meant to explore. You can’t be “in search of the unknown” or a “keep on the borderlands” without having an unknown or a border between the so-called civilized lands and the frontier.

 

[Parmandur]

Wouldn't it be funny if the Greyhawk info was just a reprint of the original folio?

I mean, it won't be. But it would be funny.

That would be my ideal, honestly, though I expect less info on heraldry and such.

 

[Parmandur]

I don't think any of the setting books fell flat, except perhaps Spelljammer. But I have to admit to not having read through it. I only know what I read about it. I know a lot of people didn't like Van Richten's Guide to Ravenloft. But I am not invested in the older material, and just going on the merits of the 5e version, I could see running an adventure or campaign using it. It may not be true to the original Ravenloft, but since I don't care about that, I thought it was fine.

Even Spelljammer isn't worthless, just too short: the campaign is excellent, solid Bestiary.

 

[TiQuinn]

That would be my ideal, honestly, though I expect less info on heraldry and such.

I expect 0% heraldry.