D&D 5E Greyhawk?

[Emirikol]

Well, that's exciting!

 

[Aaron L]

Most of the books I've read as a means of introducing the Greyhawk setting read more like a very dry history textbook.

But that's one of the things I like about it!

Seriously though, no nostalgia for Greyhawk from me; I started playing in a very generic version of the Forgotten Realms a friend of mine ran in 2nd Edition. After a while I discovered 1st Edition, and Greyhawk, on my own, and fell in love with them far more than the setting and edition I was introduced to and began playing with.

Don't get me wrong, I really like the 'Realms (how it was presented in the 1E Old Grey Box, and also later in the 3E FRCs) and especially the Elves of the 'Realms.

But I LOVE Greyhawk!

The 'Realms are all about high fantasy adventures of Good vs Evil in a world of prevalent magic, where you fight world-shattering Evils bent on destroying all civilization, and you can run into 15 year-olds chasing each other with Dancing Lights spells (which is also one of things that can turn me off the setting after too long.)

Greyhawk is about pulp adventures and dungeon delving, fighting Beholders and Mind Flayers and other twisted monsters in dark caverns beneath the earth, and subduing dragons and hauling them off to the Free City of Greyhawk to be sold on the Dragon Market. Fighting in wars between petty neighboring kingdoms (one of which may be your own!) Where there are powerful Wizards and Clerics in the world, but not one in every town and city, and they are either insane, reclusive meddlers in world politics, or rulers of their own territories (and sometimes all three at once.) And magic items aren't so prevalent that cities have streets lit with magical light posts and the local noble doesn't have his kitchen's ovens heated by bound fire elementals. Where adventurers are more likely to be tomb-robbing freebooters than noble knights questing for greatness and honor.

It's Conan and Fafhrd & the Grey Mouser, as opposed to King Arthur and Gandalf.


It's also about establishing your character as a political power and dealing with the politics of rulership; why do you think the map was so sparse? So when your Fighter hit 9th level and became a "Lord" he had plenty of room on the map to choose from to establish his keep, carve out the territory around it, and become a Baron under his own power. That was also why all the Classes in 1st Edition AD&D got followers at higher levels, so they would have the beginnings of their own armies with which to establish themselves as world players, and from then on the game becomes as much political maneuvering as adventuring.


If settings were colors, Greyhawk would be Grey, and the Forgotten Realms would be purple.

I really really really REALLY hope they release a 5th Edition Greyhawk book (or even better yet, really go oldschool and release a boxed set!!)

 

[Aaron L]

Also, someone else mentioned Suel Teiflings; that would be rad and very fitting, so long as they don't have to look like the current 4E style Teiflings. The worst thing they ever did with Teiflings was forcing them all to look like cartoonish "devilpeople" with big horns and tails, instead of each having unique deformities. I could picture Suel Teiflings as being eerily beautiful and having bone-white skin and solid black eyes, as marks of both their Suel heritage and their cursed taint.

But the 4E style blue-skinned, big-horned and tailed devilmen is just corny, cartoonish, and as unsubtle as you can get.

 

[Henrix]

I see tieflings hallowing from Iuz' generals, and from the devils called by the Aerdy Hextorites (including Ivid). And perhaps the occasional other, older tiefling.
No real old tiefling culture, though.

But I want them to be varied. Perhaps the devilish tieflings of Aerdy are more orderly than Old Wicked's.


But dragonborn? I can't see them anywhere.

 

[GameDoc]

But that's one of the things I like about it!

Seriously though, no nostalgia for Greyhawk from me; I started playing in a very generic version of the Forgotten Realms a friend of mine ran in 2nd Edition. After a while I discovered 1st Edition, and Greyhawk, on my own, and fell in love with them far more than the setting and edition I was introduced to and began playing with.

Don't get me wrong, I really like the 'Realms (how it was presented in the 1E Old Grey Box, and also later in the 3E FRCs) and especially the Elves of the 'Realms.

But I LOVE Greyhawk!

The 'Realms are all about high fantasy adventures of Good vs Evil in a world of prevalent magic, where you fight world-shattering Evils bent on destroying all civilization, and you can run into 15 year-olds chasing each other with Dancing Lights spells (which is also one of things that can turn me off the setting after too long.)

Greyhawk is about pulp adventures and dungeon delving, fighting Beholders and Mind Flayers and other twisted monsters in dark caverns beneath the earth, and subduing dragons and hauling them off to the Free City of Greyhawk to be sold on the Dragon Market. Fighting in wars between petty neighboring kingdoms (one of which may be your own!) Where there are powerful Wizards and Clerics in the world, but not one in every town and city, and they are either insane, reclusive meddlers in world politics, or rulers of their own territories (and sometimes all three at once.) And magic items aren't so prevalent that cities have streets lit with magical light posts and the local noble doesn't have his kitchen's ovens heated by bound fire elementals. Where adventurers are more likely to be tomb-robbing freebooters than noble knights questing for greatness and honor.

It's Conan and Fafhrd & the Grey Mouser, as opposed to King Arthur and Gandalf.


It's also about establishing your character as a political power and dealing with the politics of rulership; why do you think the map was so sparse? So when your Fighter hit 9th level and became a "Lord" he had plenty of room on the map to choose from to establish his keep, carve out the territory around it, and become a Baron under his own power. That was also why all the Classes in 1st Edition AD&D got followers at higher levels, so they would have the beginnings of their own armies with which to establish themselves as world players, and from then on the game becomes as much political maneuvering as adventuring.


If settings were colors, Greyhawk would be Grey, and the Forgotten Realms would be purple.

I really really really REALLY hope they release a 5th Edition Greyhawk book (or even better yet, really go oldschool and release a boxed set!!)

See - that makes me want to play in Greyhawk. But nothing I've read put forth by TSR or WotC leads off with that type of description.

 

[Henrix]

See - that makes me want to play in Greyhawk. But nothing I've read put forth by TSR or WotC leads off with that type of description.

No, Greyhawk has never had a good intro book or anything like it. But it is all there, if you wade through a lot of stuff.

Let us hope that changes.

 

[pming]

Hiya.

I may get flamed by some of the true believers but I think part of the reason Greyhawk has struggled to appeal to those who came later to D&D is presentation. Reading Ed Greenwood's (via Elminster) introduction to Forgotten Realms in the boxed sets felt like reading the prologue to a great adventure novel. Most of the books I've read as a means of introducing the Greyhawk setting read more like a very dry history textbook. Greyhawk is not a bland setting by any means, but it's sales pitch has been.

Like I always say (ok, not really always, but still): Forgotten Realms is for Players. Greyhawk is for Dungeon Masters.

(it takes a bit of contemplation to "get" what I mean by that).

^_^

Paul L. Ming

 

[GameDoc]

Hiya.



Like I always say (ok, not really always, but still): Forgotten Realms is for Players. Greyhawk is for Dungeon Masters.

(it takes a bit of contemplation to "get" what I mean by that).

^_^

Paul L. Ming

I get what you mean.

Although I also must say that my efforts to get into Greyhawk have been as a DM and not as a player. I have run the Saltmarsh series and very much enjoyed the aspect of tayloring the specifics to suit myself and my group.

I think that's what my critique of the way the publisher presents the setting speaks to. I pick up a Greyhawk manual and it seems bland. I pick up a classic module that has Greyhawk as the default setting and I'm inspired. I think most DMs these days look at the campaign setting book first and if their interest is piqued might go for the module/adventure path.

That said, if WotC would, as others suggest, give us a good adventure path set in Greyhawk, that might let the setting sell itself. Just make sure it's got the appropriate gritty feel as opposed to the high fantasy/comic bookish feel of FR.

 

[Alasomorph]

I spot copies of Ticket to Ride and Cards against Humanity - both great games. Still searching for the Pathfinder, 13th Age, and Numenera core rule books

 

[Sword of Spirit]

I get what you mean.

Although I also must say that my efforts to get into Greyhawk have been as a DM and not as a player. I have run the Saltmarsh series and very much enjoyed the aspect of tayloring the specifics to suit myself and my group.

I think that's what my critique of the way the publisher presents the setting speaks to. I pick up a Greyhawk manual and it seems bland. I pick up a classic module that has Greyhawk as the default setting and I'm inspired. I think most DMs these days look at the campaign setting book first and if their interest is piqued might go for the module/adventure path.

That said, if WotC would, as others suggest, give us a good adventure path set in Greyhawk, that might let the setting sell itself. Just make sure it's got the appropriate gritty feel as opposed to the high fantasy/comic bookish feel of FR.

I'm not really into adventure paths, but if they do decide to have them do double duty as advertising for a follow-up campaign setting book, I'm all for it. Anything that lets me have any necessary updates for my classic campaign settings.