D&D 5E Has 5E Restored or Diminished Your Faith in WotC?

[Herschel]

Really? How is announcing an open playtest and actually demoing the prototype game at a con NOT reaching out to fans? I'm seeing the opposite of what you're describing.

I think the NDAs are really rubbing some people the wrong way. I can sympathize even if I'm not really in agreement. So far we've gotten:

1. "Hey, we're making a new edition! We want your feedback and we're having OPEN playtesting!"

2. "Hey, we've got public playtesting here at DDXP! It's really great, all you have to do is come to Fort Wayne (no thanks) and sign an NDA! That's right, a whole bunch of people are playing and they can't tell you anything about it!"

3. "Hey, we had a great public paytest, so glad you could all come out. As for the rest of you (who are the vast majority), well we're still not telling you anything except the vast majority of your speculation is wrong."

We're an instantanious society. If you say you're going to give us something it had better be downloadable yesterday. It's also that for a supposed "open/public" playtest, very few people have been privy to anything. *shrugs*

 

[Umbran]

I think people like to have faith in a company.

Well, you're talking "like to have". I'm talking "need".

Last week, I went into a sandwich shop to get lunch. I ordered my sandwich, paid my money, and headed back to work. At my desk, I discovered a square of tasty dark chocolate in the bag, along with my sandwich and chips.

I liked to have the chocolate, certainly. It made my day better! But I didn't need it. I was happy with my sandwich at the price I paid for it, and would have (in fact did) happily purchase a sandwich not knowing it came with chocolate.

As a consumer, I need to have some measure of faith in a company if I'm going to put some sort of investment in their product sight-unseen. This is not the case with WotC - they'll put out a product, and I'll be able to look it over, and decide if I want it or not. Faith is not required, on my end.

Now, faith is nice to have. I like to feel good about the company ahead of time. And, just to be clear, I like how they seem to be handling the run-up to the new edition, too. They're clearly paying attention, and playing it smart. But, if anything, what they are doing is reducing my need for faith - their eventual release of the beta-rules will give me a free taste ahead of time!

Or, if it is more palatable: I consider it rewarding good behavior. And their behavior this go 'round is very, very good indeed.

I have no problem at all with folks rewarding the company when it does things they like. Reactions like your make my moderating job *sooo* much easier

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

Between Pathfinder, retroclones, and this debacle, I think I've finally realized that I don't need WotC to play D&D.

Welcome to the club! We have +1 oatmeal cookies in the members' lounge.

Faith implies a degree of emotional investment I reserve for family and friends. WotC is unworthy of both my faith and my moral outrage, as are other game-makers.

 

[Charwoman Gene]

It sounds like they are taking away choice. In 4e, it's fairly easy for me to realize a character concept, with very few restrictions. I would rather have seen them take that a step further, and build a system where you could realize any concept. Alas, they are going back to cliches and straight jackets.

Please explain more. They've released the most rudimentary core, and no character creation details. How did you get the impression that 5e isn't going to allow wildly dynamic character concepts?

 

[Tallifer]

I was shocked to learn about the immanence of the Fifth Edition and the death knell of the Fourth, although I had felt more betrayed previously when the Essentials were foist upon us.

I am more and more displeased with the hints and statements being made from on high about the Fifth Edition. The diminishment of Powers and Fighters, feat taxes to buy back the options of the Fourth Edition for our characters, saving throws based on all six abilities, Vancian spell lists, certain classes relegated to themes, healing regressed according to some vague reports, skills made complicated, alignment made strict again with the restoration of the great wheel, the Forgotten Realms put front and centre, halfhearted promises to keep the on-line resources for the Fourth Edition.

Nonetheless even though I have very little faith in the Fifth Edition, I do appreciate that the Wizards of the Coast have made a bold move as a company, which may save them from what was looking like certain oblivion. If the Wizards do well with this new edition among Old School grognards and fanatics of Pathfinder and the Third Edition, then their survival should ensure the vestigial survival of the Fourth Edition as well. I do hope that the Wizards make a proper Red Box this time, which actually teaches a relevant core of the game and offers more than 2 levels of play: that would bring new gamers into the fold with the rest of the players of the new system.

 

[Charwoman Gene]

Really? How is announcing an open playtest and actually demoing the prototype game at a con NOT reaching out to fans? I'm seeing the opposite of what you're describing.

I think people assume that D&Dn is at the stage that 4e was in at D&D XP 2008.

It's more like it was 2006...

 

[thedungeondelver]

Well, you're talking "like to have". I'm talking "need".

Tomato/to-MAH-to, but fair enough. I think we're on the same sheet of music, just different verses is all.

I have no problem at all with folks rewarding the company when it does things they like. Reactions like your make my moderating job *sooo* much easier

Well if you need some excitement with your job I can certainly go back to being an irascible, reactionary edition-warrior. I'm kidding! I kid...!

 

[Jeff Carlsen]

I slowly lost respect for WotC through the first couple years of 4E. But, never completely. If I recall, it was Martial Power 2 that finally made me stop buying their stuff. Something about that product's existence rubbed me the wrong way.

Essentials restored some, but by then Paizo had already earned a huge amount of respect from me, and to this day I can't stop comparing them.

But, the 5E news has given me a small piece of hope. I get the feeling that they really want to make an amazing game that I'll love. And they have the talent to do that. But until I see the actual product line on shelves, and until it's been out for a year or two, I'm not going to know if I can truly respect them they way I used to.

Lastly, for the serious fans of 4E, don't assume you're being abandoned yet. We know almost nothing about the more complex end of the 5E design. They've said very clearly that they want to build upon a simple core, and that getting that core right first is critical. I suspect that the first public playtests will involve that core, with more modules being added over time as they get the more basic stuff ironed out. So, right now, it seems like they're ignoring you, but by necessity they have to save the stuff you'll like for later.

 

[Starglyte]

Neither. The game won't be released till sometime next year, so its hard to for me to gain or lose faith for WOTC.

 

[Vyvyan Basterd]

It's also that for a supposed "open/public" playtest, very few people have been privy to anything. *shrugs*

That's only because people aren't paying attention. The playtest at D&DXP was *public* as in anyone was welcome, but not *open*. The open playtesting begins in the spring.