Has anyone ever taken these feats? And why?

[Shag]

I'm pretty new to 4E and I was wondering: Has anyone ever taken these feats?

Astral Fire, Burning Blizzard, Dark Fury, Power Attack, Raging Storm, Weapon Focus etc. All these feats do nothing but grant a +1 or +2 to damage. They don't seem to do anything else? Are they prerequisites for something else?

Since Minions die on any hit that does damage these don't help very much, and now that monsters seems to have loads of HP (a goblin has 29!), a couple points of damage for the price of a precious feat seems like a waste. My players noticed this right away and haven't used them.

Wouldn't it make more sense to maybe have the feat increase the damage die by 1? Sorta like the feat 'Backstabber' does? That way on an encounter or daily power that uses multiple weapon damage these feats would really pay for themselves.

I've only been playing for 3 months or so and it already seems like 4E needs a 4.5E.

 

[Dragongrief]

Wouldn't it make more sense to maybe have the feat increase the damage die by 1? Sorta like the feat 'Backstabber' does? That way on an encounter or daily power that uses multiple weapon damage these feats would really pay for themselves.

Your example is actually why those feats would be better. Weapon focus (for example) is part of the weapon damage and would be count in x[W] damage effects, while Sneak Attack is a separate effect and would not be.

Those feats are also unconditional: use X power or Y weapon, get the bonus. Backstabber requires CA, Deadly Quarry (or whatever the Ranger version is) required your Quarried opponent.

They definitely aren't a first choice for most builds, but neither are they a "never take".

 

[fba827]

also those types of feats do more for casters. and casters generally have more ability to hit multiple people (ie spread out area damage) rather than single target damage.
So it evens out over time if you do a lot of area attacks.

But over all, yeah, they are handy. Does everyone take them? Na. Does no one take them at all? na. it works for what some people want to achieve (which is every little bit of damage).

And, honestly, sometimes you just want a simple feat rather than a complex "this feat lets you do X if you're bloodied, you're charging, and it's sunny outside while scoring a crit.." -- that consistent +1/+2 is just easier to work with since you can just flatly add it in to your stats.

 

[Wik]

I'm pretty new to 4E and I was wondering: Has anyone ever taken these feats?

Astral Fire, Burning Blizzard, Dark Fury, Power Attack, Raging Storm, Weapon Focus etc. All these feats do nothing but grant a +1 or +2 to damage. They don't seem to do anything else? Are they prerequisites for something else?

Since Minions die on any hit that does damage these don't help very much, and now that monsters seems to have loads of HP (a goblin has 29!), a couple points of damage for the price of a precious feat seems like a waste. My players noticed this right away and haven't used them.

Wouldn't it make more sense to maybe have the feat increase the damage die by 1? Sorta like the feat 'Backstabber' does? That way on an encounter or daily power that uses multiple weapon damage these feats would really pay for themselves.

I've only been playing for 3 months or so and it already seems like 4E needs a 4.5E.

Everyone takes Weapon Focus in our group. In a single combat, that +1 extra damage at heroic level adds up - anytime the enemy is down to 1 HP, just remember where you'd be had you taken Weapon Focus.

If you make multiple attacks in a round (such as, say, a fighter's come and get it attack), you can potentially deal and extra three or damage IN ONE ROUND. Which is more damage than an extra die of damage.

Power Attack is well liked by our fighter, too. It's a risk, sure, but there are times where he's sure he's got an edge in to hit likelihood. So, he drops his attack and deals extra damage. And it adds up!

 

[malcolm_n]

I love Power Attack when I'm wielding a two-handed weapon. The +3, 6, 9 damage for only a -2 penalty to attack is awesome; way better than it was back in 3.5 when you had to take -1 attack per +2 damage in the same scenario.

Weapon focus for +1, +2, +3 damage is not quite as good as it was back when it was weapon specialization, but now you don't have to be a fighter to take it. Weapon expertise is as good, then better than weapon focus used to be for attacks, since 1 feat gives you up to a +3 bonus to attack rather than just a +1 or 2 feats for +2.

I will say I've never used the energy friendly feats you mention; but then I've only played one spellcaster since I started playing 4e at the beginning of it all, and he's not the type to focus on damage.

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

I like Weapon Focus because it's a simple unconditional bonus I don't have to think about. And 1 damage really does make a difference more than you'd think--my group have dropped monsters to 1 or 2 hp quite a few times. And I've heard that a lot of groups have that experience. So take Weapon Focus, and tell your friends!

The elemental focus knock-offs are lame because they apply to what, maybe half your powers? I've never seen anybody take any of those, so I wrote an Implement Focus feat for my players instead. (I don't buy the "multi-targeting powers make up for the suckitude of the elemental focus knock-offs" idea; multi-target powers, and non-weapon powers are already nerfed enough.)

 

[blargney the second]

Everyone takes Weapon Focus in our group. In a single combat, that +1 extra damage at heroic level adds up - anytime the enemy is down to 1 HP, just remember where you'd be had you taken Weapon Focus.

If you make multiple attacks in a round (such as, say, a fighter's come and get it attack), you can potentially deal and extra three or damage IN ONE ROUND. Which is more damage than an extra die of damage.

Power Attack is well liked by our fighter, too. It's a risk, sure, but there are times where he's sure he's got an edge in to hit likelihood. So, he drops his attack and deals extra damage. And it adds up!

Now that we're paragon, Weapon Focus is giving +2 damage on every hit. It really does add up quickly with multi-attack powers. (Originally I took Weapon Focus on my fighter because I was playing two PCs when we started 4e, so I wanted to make sure they had mostly passive bonuses that would minimize brain cycles at the table.)

I don't like 4e's Power Attack nearly as much as I do in 3.5. -2 to hit is highly significant most of the time, and not really worth the risk. However, our bard can frequently get us up to +5 to +10 to hit, so it's lovely to be able to convert that excess accuracy into gonzo damage. I just wish I could use PA on my close burst powers with a melee weapon. :-(

As an aside, we've known all along that this campaign would end mid-paragon. With that end nigh, I'm bummed that we won't get to level up much more because I've finally taken the essential feats to make my character work the way he's supposed to. From here on out I can start taking more interesting feats... but "here on out" is most likely just 1 more feat at this point!
-blarg

 

[Shag]

Thanks! I didn't know it added to 'weapon damage' I guess this is why you just let the builder calculate everything.
I'll see how it goes, it just seems too small a bonus for a feat to me.
I just don't see how a +1 to damage, even if it gets multiplies a bit really adds up that much, when you consider how many hp stuff has now. Especially when you compare that to a bonus to Defenses or to hit, which is an all or nothing (mostly) roll.
Maybe I just don't get 4E math yet.

 

[malcolm_n]

That multiple +1 damage is the same, and sometimes more than, your suggestion of increasing die size when you consider averages. Average d6 is 3.5, average d8 is 4.5; so it's the same when it's d6+1 and better when it becomes d6+2 (5.5 or d10 equivalent). Plus your minimum is better, since you don't roll 1s anymore, technically you roll 2s then 3s.

 

[Holy Bovine]

I'm pretty new to 4E and I was wondering: Has anyone ever taken these feats?

Astral Fire, Burning Blizzard, Dark Fury, Power Attack, Raging Storm, Weapon Focus etc. All these feats do nothing but grant a +1 or +2 to damage. They don't seem to do anything else? Are they prerequisites for something else?

Since Minions die on any hit that does damage these don't help very much, and now that monsters seems to have loads of HP (a goblin has 29!), a couple points of damage for the price of a precious feat seems like a waste. My players noticed this right away and haven't used them.

With the exception of Power Attack I have seen players use all of those feats. I myself have a barbarian with weapon focus. Things like Astral Fire are nice since they get added to 2 different energy attacks and most PCs who use them (ie wizards, invokers etc) can hit multiple opponents getting the extra damage on all of them.

You will find that you do end up with a lot of feats so spending one to get a damage bonus isn't that big a deal. As you say monsters have more hps in 4E so shouldn't you, by way of compensation, find ways to do more damage?