Has lack of an insider account kept you from playing 4E?

[MacMathan]

Just a sidenote to all the DMs worried about players wanting to use everything in the default DDI, make sure to create a custom campaign file for it and send it out to your players. They won't even see options you don't want to include and I have found it to be quite granular.

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[Aegeri]

How do you do that?

 

[wayne62682]

Just a sidenote to all the DMs worried about players wanting to use everything in the default DDI, make sure to create a custom campaign file for it and send it out to your players. They won't even see options you don't want to include and I have found it to be quite granular.

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Ironically the biggest reason I would advocate the use of DDI is so you can avoid the old "I don't allow Book X because I don't own it" scenario from 3.5. If it's in the DDI, it ought to be legal for use except in very extreme circumstances (e.g. very specific type of campaign that would remove some options), and not because of "control issues". But that's just me, and I've been soured from 3.5 of having most of the books and never being able to use half of them because I was the only one who owned them.

 

[Somebloke]

Insiderwhatamous?

Sorry, but I haven't gone back to the Wotc site since 4e came out and it hasn't slowed down our love of the game one bit.

 

[Bullgrit]

I've been soured from XX of having most of the books and never being able to use half of them because I was the only one who owned them.

Why do you buy the books? If to just read them, then not being able to use them shouldn't bother you. If you don't want to buy unless you can use them, you should ask your DM first, before buying.

I've never understood this mentality of "If they publish it, I must buy it, you must use it."

Bullgrit

 

[wayne62682]

I bought the books because they had useful information, and I (wrongly) figured since they were published for use with the game, they would be allowed. THAT mentality came from 2e where all of the books were allowed (you know, the Complete XX Handbooks) simply because they were published.

 

[Lord_Blacksteel]

I think the use/non-use of CB does impact the "standard" expectations for campaigns in general.

1st ed locally the standard was PHB and then the question was how much Dragon material would the DM allow. Later UA was another yes/no depending on the DM.

2nd ed it was PHB + would the DM allow the class/race books, specialty priests, and Tome of Magic.

3rd edition was PHB standard then did the DM allow class books? Dragon classes? Did they go to 3.5? How about PHB2 classes? What prestige classes? In fact there really wasn't a standard for much of 3rd edition around here - it was significantly different from DM to DM and even campaign to campaign.

Now with 4th the CB has a sort of standardizing effect noted in some earlier posts - the expectation is that if it's in the CB it's in a "normal" game. Restrict it and eyebrows are raised. House Rule and eyebrows are raised. It's certainly less chaotic than late 3rd edition, but it does feel a little more constrained in that instead of potential players being excited about what the DM does allow they seem concerned about what the DM doesn't allow or has changed. It's partially a perceptual thing - with 4th you are removing options from the CB instead of how it was in 3rd where you were allowing new books beyond the PHB. A small difference maybe but I see it as a huge shift in expectations.

 

[KidSnide]

I think the use/non-use of CB does impact the "standard" expectations for campaigns in general.

1st ed locally the standard was PHB and then the question was how much Dragon material would the DM allow. Later UA was another yes/no depending on the DM.

2nd ed it was PHB + would the DM allow the class/race books, specialty priests, and Tome of Magic.

3rd edition was PHB standard then did the DM allow class books? Dragon classes? Did they go to 3.5? How about PHB2 classes? What prestige classes? In fact there really wasn't a standard for much of 3rd edition around here - it was significantly different from DM to DM and even campaign to campaign.

Now with 4th the CB has a sort of standardizing effect noted in some earlier posts - the expectation is that if it's in the CB it's in a "normal" game. Restrict it and eyebrows are raised. House Rule and eyebrows are raised. It's certainly less chaotic than late 3rd edition, but it does feel a little more constrained in that instead of potential players being excited about what the DM does allow they seem concerned about what the DM doesn't allow or has changed. It's partially a perceptual thing - with 4th you are removing options from the CB instead of how it was in 3rd where you were allowing new books beyond the PHB. A small difference maybe but I see it as a huge shift in expectations.

Of course, the other big effect of the CB is that it's cut down on campaign specific material. Most homebrew settings would be helped by a few custom weapons, feats, paragon paths and maybe some special powers too. You can fake some of that with house rules, but - by and large - it doesn't help GMs adapt the rules to their gameworlds.

-KS

 

[Dausuul]

Why do you buy the books? If to just read them, then not being able to use them shouldn't bother you. If you don't want to buy unless you can use them, you should ask your DM first, before buying.

I've never understood this mentality of "If they publish it, I must buy it, you must use it."

Bullgrit

I must spread experience around.

 

[Man in the Funny Hat]

I bought the books because they had useful information, and I (wrongly) figured since they were published for use with the game, they would be allowed. THAT mentality came from 2e where all of the books were allowed (you know, the Complete XX Handbooks) simply because they were published.

And if you now understand the underpinnings of that 2E mentality and the RESPONSE to it you know why your expectation of your purchases being allowed by default was in error. If you learned the lesson of 2E you should know that it covers ALL games. It surfaced immediately in 3E and will carry forward forevermore. Rule 0: check with your DM.