D&D 4E Hasbro, Greyhawk, and 4E speculation

[Vigilance]

Yeah, like you would know!

Wait, aren't we supposed to ignore everything Mike Mearls and Charles Ryan say about D&D?

Im so confused.

(And yes, gentle reader, that is mild sarcasm)

Chuck

 

[Orius]

Really, what spurred me to start this thread was the bizarre handling of Greyhawk,

What's so bizarre? I doubt Greyhawk is all that profitable to begin with. First off, you got all those old guard gamers who want D&D to be all about Greyhawk and nothing else. However, they typically haven't liked anything in the setting that was released since the early 90's or earlier and many absolutely refuse to buy anything new. Newer gamers who don't have the brand loyalty don't have the attraction to the setting; after all, there really isn't that much different between Greyhawk and the Realms and a newer gamer isn't going to have any reason to choose one setting over the other, if he chooses one at all (or goes for Eberron instead).

 

[philreed]

I don't think Hasbro makes a dime.

Money has already changed hands for those rights. You think Infogrames will pay the Hasbro royalties too? I think the electronic developer (the people who actually make the electronic game) will be lucky if THEY get royalties (assuming Infogrames doesn't do the development themselves). Hasbro?

Not a chance.
As I said, Hasbro is squeezing everything they can out of it before they get rid of it.

There's no way to say this that doesn't sound mean but you're wrong. Hasbro makes money on every single game sold. I have experience with royalties and licensing and can assure you that there's no way in hell Hasbro (or anyone) signed a license that doesn't make them money.

 

[mearls]

Do you think from a monetary standpoint it would be better for the bottom line of Hasbro to have D&D tightly integrated with the random miniatures line in the next edition? Or would the possible monetary gain, if any, be too small to have a major design impact on the next edition?

D&D minis are separate from the RPG side of things. RPG R&D staffers (like me) work on the line, along with developers who work on Magic and Axis & Allies miniatures.

The D&D minis line has little impact on the strategic direction of D&D. Aside from monsters first introduced in the D&D minis game (sword archon, wrackspawn, bloodhulk), the minis game doesn't influence D&D design as you might suspect. I've never encountered the attitude here that we need to make D&D players buy more miniatures by messing with D&D. We aim to get more people to buy by producing awesome miniatures that people want to buy.

 

[Bastoche]

Hasbro is a stock company. Each decision (such as selling D&D) would have to be told to the investors. In that case, the public. If it was to happen, we would know.

 

[Sanguinemetaldawn]

This reveals a singular lack of knowledge in how licensed properties work, at least to my knowledge.

Every single licensed property I've ever discussed wanted an up front payment and a quarterly payment, and these were licenses way WAY less attractive than D&D.

Its possible that Hasbro will be paid revenue from the D&D brand no matter how well the property does on an electronic platform. Its possible that Hasbro will be paid if the game meets a certain profit level. Its possible Hasbro will not be paid at all for income generated from the D&D brand.

Do you have any specific knowledge of the contract? Especially in light of the far-reaching agreement between the two companies on the D&D brand specifically?

I'd really like to know if you do.

Keep in mind, in the new agreement between Hasbro and Infogrames, Hasbro was the party giving things up (for example, the $65 million pay out to Infogrames to recover rights they sold). That is the proper context for this analysis.



All of this is really academic though. The simple fact is, we know Hasbro gave away more rights on the D&D brand than any of the other 16 brands involved in the deal, which goes right back to the point I have been making from the first post on this thread.

 

[Falstaff]

D&D minis are separate from the RPG side of things. RPG R&D staffers (like me) work on the line, along with developers who work on Magic and Axis & Allies miniatures.

The D&D minis line has little impact on the strategic direction of D&D. Aside from monsters first introduced in the D&D minis game (sword archon, wrackspawn, bloodhulk), the minis game doesn't influence D&D design as you might suspect. I've never encountered the attitude here that we need to make D&D players buy more miniatures by messing with D&D. We aim to get more people to buy by producing awesome miniatures that people want to buy.

Don't make me laugh. I can't speak for all the posters around here, but I'm not this gullible.

There's nothing you can say that'll convience me that D&D v3.5 and all its new terms like 'squares' for movement and other details on terrain and diagonal moves WASN'T included to prod (require?) gamers to buy D&D's new miniatures. I would argue that it is near impossible to run a D&D v.3.5 combat WITHOUT minis.

 

[Sanguinemetaldawn]

Completely incorrect.

If it isn't profitable, it isn't worth that kind of cash.

OK, you missed the basic point I was making in my facetious reply.

People will buy things that are losing money.
Period.
There are a lot of reasons.

Something can have inherent value while still generating a loss, and there are too many examples of how a property can be made better than ever (even though it was losing money), to be worth my time to explain.

 

[Belen]

D&D minis are separate from the RPG side of things. RPG R&D staffers (like me) work on the line, along with developers who work on Magic and Axis & Allies miniatures.

The D&D minis line has little impact on the strategic direction of D&D. Aside from monsters first introduced in the D&D minis game (sword archon, wrackspawn, bloodhulk), the minis game doesn't influence D&D design as you might suspect. I've never encountered the attitude here that we need to make D&D players buy more miniatures by messing with D&D. We aim to get more people to buy by producing awesome miniatures that people want to buy.

Well, aside from rules such as "swift" action being ported into the D&D game from the minis game or the new cross-product Fantastic locations right?

 

[Aust Diamondew]

I like your theory, it's new and different than all the other doomsday theories. Your dooms day theory is cool!