D&D 5E Help me understand & find the fun in OC/neo-trad play...

[bloodtide]

Nothing in this post is true of Neotrad. I have no idea where you got some of these ideas. No, I throw things at my gamers all the time, I'm not just forever waiting for them to make a move so I can react.

This is the scale though. Sure your game is the 1 where you have non trigged events happen, but a lot of Neo T games are the 10 where everything must be player driven.

100%, the only thing I agree with is that it's probably not going to be random? To use above example, that wizard is likely linked with something trying to prevent the PCs from achieving an aim. Maybe it's a minion, maybe they have secured an artifact of arcane power, etc. Pressuring the players and putting barriers in their way respondent to declared goals and intents is a key component.

I don't think trad play would have a random wizard just...show up to attack teh PCs either?

Right.

The first part is just the pure DM whim. The DM simply decides to have an events happen, 100% independent of anything the characters have done. But it is not random...it is just the players don't know the "why".

And the second part is that it is not linked to the main plot or story at all. It is just an event.

 

[zakael19]

Are you trying to contrast this to a wandering monster / random encounter table? I’m pretty baffled with the point or distinction you’re trying to draw.

 

[bloodtide]

Yeah he's posted like 10 times with strawman arguments where he defines "neo-triad" (sic) as something completely different from reality and then proceeds to bash on how bad it is.

Every playstyle will sound awful when misrepresented by someone who hates it and is biased against it.

I bash nothing, just show the differences.

Are you trying to contrast this to a wandering monster / random encounter table? I’m pretty baffled with the point or distinction you’re trying to draw.

For a lot of Neo T games, things only happen when and if the characters do or don't do actions.

In a Traditional game, things happen on the DMs whim.....independent of whatever the characters do.

 

[DrJawaPhD]

I bash nothing, just show the differences.

You show only the difference between what you imagine neo-trad to mean and what it actually is in reality. If I ever saw a table playing the way you describe neo-trad I would run away in a hurry. Luckily I've never seen anything remotely resembling what you describe

 

[prabe]

Every playstyle will sound awful when misrepresented by someone who hates it and is biased against it.

You've heard me talk about Story Now?

 

[Micah Sweet]

I always thought "the DM arbitrarily screwing over the players" was Classic style-- using Tomb of Horror-style trap dungeons and stating that X number of spells just don't work for no discernable reason other than it would make it too easy for the players to get through all the DM's Saw-like traps that they expected the players to stumble through with no way of knowing how they were supposed to get past them other than trial and error.

That just sounds like houserules to me. People ban stuff in their own games all the time.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I think that might be a better description: plot- vs character-focused gaming. And far easier to understand at first blush. But before anyone takes it to the absurd extreme: no, that’s not implying plot to the exclusion of character nor character to the exclusion of plot. Though both extremes clearly exist in the wider world of RPGs.

I prefer setting over character or plot, but I'm odd that way.

 

[Micah Sweet]

You show only the difference between what you imagine neo-trad to mean and what it actually is in reality. If I ever saw a table playing the way you describe neo-trad I would run away in a hurry. Luckily I've never seen anything remotely resembling what you describe

Clearly, "reality" differs from table to table then, assuming everyone is arguing in good faith of course.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I prefer setting over character or plot, but I'm odd that way.

Everyone is odd. It may be unusual, but it's just as valid as anything else.

Of course, it's not on the "officially accepted list of playstyles", so clearly you do not exist!

 

[Micah Sweet]

So first, to be clear: by "rule zero"/"golden rule" is meant the idea that the GM can suspend the resolution rules at any point in the interests of "the story".

And every RPG I play is functional without that rule: 4e D&D, MHRP, Prince Valiant, Burning Wheel, Torchbearer, etc.

I don't recall a version of Rule Zero that specifically mentions, "the story". Which book says that?