Help with pricing and naming this bow
- Thread starter Akhkharu
- Start date
kreynolds
First Post
Ok. Now this is odd. I just went back and looked at all the items I made and....well....I did double the cost of the secondary powers. Huh. Guess I read that somewhere. Well, at least it's nice to know that I've been doing it right! Well, so I messed up on the Bow. That's what I get for rushing and trying to impress everybody. 
bleedthefreak
First Post
Re: Re: Re: Re: Pass without trace?
I must have mis-read something, I got it from seankreynolds.com's blades of fearun? Did I misunderstand?
kreynolds said:
I must have mis-read something, I got it from seankreynolds.com's blades of fearun? Did I misunderstand?
bleedthefreak
First Post
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Cost..
Hey, *I* and I am sure everyone here really appreciates all the help and feedback as well as the rules clarifications.
Thanks for working on my bow as well, I want it to be pretty comparable in price to a Mighty Composite (+2) Longbow of wounding +3, for reasons I cannot go into as some of my players grace these boards on occasion...
kreynolds said:
Touche'. DOH! And I was so darn close to getting it perfect! Ya' know, I create magic items almost every day, but I can't get them right on the boards. It's the pressure I tell ya'! Too much PRESSURE!!!!!!
Hey, *I* and I am sure everyone here really appreciates all the help and feedback as well as the rules clarifications.
Thanks for working on my bow as well, I want it to be pretty comparable in price to a Mighty Composite (+2) Longbow of wounding +3, for reasons I cannot go into as some of my players grace these boards on occasion...
Hypersmurf
Moderatarrrrh...
DMG p243 : Multiple Similar Abilities.
Where it says "For items that do take up a limited space (such as a ring or a necklace), each additional power not only has no discount, but instead has a 10% increase in price."
From memory, that's a typo, and should read "a 100% increase".
But a weapon is not a limited space item, and should be eligible for the similar-abilities discount, I would have thought.
-Hyp.
kreynolds
First Post
Hyper, for the life of me I can't remember where I read that secondary powers should be doubled. But I have looked back at the numerous magic items I have created, well over 60, and they are properly calculated on every single one of them, as I have doubled the price of secondary costs. I don't get it. Sean's site says to double weapon secondary powers, and technically, it makes sense. Weapons don't take up a slot on your body so naturally the cost should be doubled. Obviously simple weapon enhancements are also doubled, as you total up the bonus, say +3, then square it and multiply it by 2,000 gp. Unlike armor, which is always the bonus squared x 1,000gp. So, it does make perfect sense. I just wish I could remember where it was!
I think you are right about the discount for similar abilities on weapons. At least I sure hope you are because I have thought I have been right for over a year now!
Staffs receive the discount for multiple spells. For all the weapons I have made that have multiple powers (spells) I have applied the same discount system. I figured since staffs don't take up a slot, no more than a weapon does, then a weapon should also receive the same discount. And the price increase is 10%. Create two items with identical sets of multiple powers, one that takes a slot and one that doesn't, and you will see that the pricing system actually makes sense. Items that don't take a slot are obscenely expensive. But items that do are still really expensive. The 10% increase in price is basically character power management built into the system.
I firmly believe you and I are right about this. I just wish I knew where I read it! Argh!
I think you are right about the discount for similar abilities on weapons. At least I sure hope you are because I have thought I have been right for over a year now!
Staffs receive the discount for multiple spells. For all the weapons I have made that have multiple powers (spells) I have applied the same discount system. I figured since staffs don't take up a slot, no more than a weapon does, then a weapon should also receive the same discount. And the price increase is 10%. Create two items with identical sets of multiple powers, one that takes a slot and one that doesn't, and you will see that the pricing system actually makes sense. Items that don't take a slot are obscenely expensive. But items that do are still really expensive. The 10% increase in price is basically character power management built into the system.I firmly believe you and I are right about this. I just wish I knew where I read it! Argh!
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Lord Pendragon
First Post
Wouldn't any ability, outside of those listed in the weapons' enchantments section of the DMG (such as shocking, flaming, etc.) count as the equivalent of a slotless item? Seems odd that I could, for instance, stick spell turning on my longsword instead of my ring, and get a discount to the price...
Just a thought.
Just a thought.
kreynolds
First Post
Longbow for bleedthefreak
Ok. I created a low level version of the Deeper Darkness spell, which I think is pretty balanced. Opinions are welcome of course, though I would recommend that any opinions are started on the House Rules thread. After all, I did create a custom spell. Unless all of you think its ok to...well...I don't care where you reply. I'll find it.
Here goes. I'll show the spell first. First, I should mention that this weapon and spell was created by an evil cleric. Evil was a necessity due to the unholy enchantment.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Lesser Deeper Darkness
Evocation [Darkness]
Level: Clr 1
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Touch
Target: Object touched
Duration: 1 minute/level
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No
This spell causes the object touched to shed absolute darkness in a 10-foot radius. Even creatures that can normally see in the dark cannot see through this magical darkness. If the spell is cast on a small object that is then placed inside or under a lightproof covering, the spell’s effects are blocked until the covering is removed.
------------------------------------------------------------------
OK. That's the spell. Now, on to the weapon itself.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Inkblotter: This wicked +2 unholy longbow is enchanted with the power of darkness. As a standard action that does not provoke an attack of opportunity, the wielder may enchant an arrow with lesser deeper darkness. The arrow then transfers the spell upon successfully striking a target. This power must be activated before the attack roll. The lesser deeper darkness spell will not affect creatures struck, though it can bestow the spell upon any object struck. However, it is important to note that magic items may save against this effect.
Caster Level: 12th; Prerequisites: Craft Magic Arms and Armor, lesser deeper darkness, unholy blight, creator must be evil; Market Price: 34,875 gp.
------------------------------------------------------------------
OK. That's the weapon. Here is the price breakdown. God I hope I get this right, otherwise, I'm going to make a fool out of myself in front of Hypesmurf.
------------------------------------------------------------------
+2 enhancement bonus and +2 bonus from unholy enhancement = 4 x 4 x 2,000 gp = 32,000 gp
lesser deeper darkness power
1 (spell level) x 1 (caster level) x 2,000 gp x 2 = 4,000 gp
*This power is only usable 3/day
5/3 = 1.6 (I rounded down from 1.6666666666666666666666666666667 because it gave me an easier number to work with.)
4,000 gp / 1.6 = 2,500
Longbow = 75 gp
Masterwork Quality = 300 gp
Total Cost = 32,000 gp + 2,500 gp + 75 gp + 300 gp = 34,875 gp
------------------------------------------------------------------
OK. Now this is the most important part. Lesser Deeper Darkness functions just like deeper darkness in that the spell does not effect creatures. It must be transfered to an object, just like the spell. The trick here is that you can just shoot the ground at their feet, next to them, behind them, whatever. If you're feeling really cocky, just shoot their shield or something, though how that works exactly is up to your DM. Besides, even deeper darkness wasn't really made for this, though I can see it working quite nicely. So! The basics! You enchant the arrow as a standard action, shoot it at an object, and the object is now emanating Lesser Deeper Darkness.
This is just like enchanting an arrow with Disintegrate. When you do that, does the arrow disintegrate? Nope. The target struck is under the effect of the spell and normal saving throws against magic items apply. However, keep in mind that Deeper Darkness and Lesser Deeper Darkness do not allow saving throws because they cannot be cast upon creatures, only objects. This bow adheres to that.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, that's it. So...what do ya' think?
Ok. I created a low level version of the Deeper Darkness spell, which I think is pretty balanced. Opinions are welcome of course, though I would recommend that any opinions are started on the House Rules thread. After all, I did create a custom spell. Unless all of you think its ok to...well...I don't care where you reply. I'll find it.
Here goes. I'll show the spell first. First, I should mention that this weapon and spell was created by an evil cleric. Evil was a necessity due to the unholy enchantment.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Lesser Deeper Darkness
Evocation [Darkness]
Level: Clr 1
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Touch
Target: Object touched
Duration: 1 minute/level
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No
This spell causes the object touched to shed absolute darkness in a 10-foot radius. Even creatures that can normally see in the dark cannot see through this magical darkness. If the spell is cast on a small object that is then placed inside or under a lightproof covering, the spell’s effects are blocked until the covering is removed.
------------------------------------------------------------------
OK. That's the spell. Now, on to the weapon itself.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Inkblotter: This wicked +2 unholy longbow is enchanted with the power of darkness. As a standard action that does not provoke an attack of opportunity, the wielder may enchant an arrow with lesser deeper darkness. The arrow then transfers the spell upon successfully striking a target. This power must be activated before the attack roll. The lesser deeper darkness spell will not affect creatures struck, though it can bestow the spell upon any object struck. However, it is important to note that magic items may save against this effect.
Caster Level: 12th; Prerequisites: Craft Magic Arms and Armor, lesser deeper darkness, unholy blight, creator must be evil; Market Price: 34,875 gp.
------------------------------------------------------------------
OK. That's the weapon. Here is the price breakdown. God I hope I get this right, otherwise, I'm going to make a fool out of myself in front of Hypesmurf.
------------------------------------------------------------------
+2 enhancement bonus and +2 bonus from unholy enhancement = 4 x 4 x 2,000 gp = 32,000 gp
lesser deeper darkness power
1 (spell level) x 1 (caster level) x 2,000 gp x 2 = 4,000 gp
*This power is only usable 3/day
5/3 = 1.6 (I rounded down from 1.6666666666666666666666666666667 because it gave me an easier number to work with.)
4,000 gp / 1.6 = 2,500
Longbow = 75 gp
Masterwork Quality = 300 gp
Total Cost = 32,000 gp + 2,500 gp + 75 gp + 300 gp = 34,875 gp
------------------------------------------------------------------
OK. Now this is the most important part. Lesser Deeper Darkness functions just like deeper darkness in that the spell does not effect creatures. It must be transfered to an object, just like the spell. The trick here is that you can just shoot the ground at their feet, next to them, behind them, whatever. If you're feeling really cocky, just shoot their shield or something, though how that works exactly is up to your DM. Besides, even deeper darkness wasn't really made for this, though I can see it working quite nicely. So! The basics! You enchant the arrow as a standard action, shoot it at an object, and the object is now emanating Lesser Deeper Darkness.
This is just like enchanting an arrow with Disintegrate. When you do that, does the arrow disintegrate? Nope. The target struck is under the effect of the spell and normal saving throws against magic items apply. However, keep in mind that Deeper Darkness and Lesser Deeper Darkness do not allow saving throws because they cannot be cast upon creatures, only objects. This bow adheres to that.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, that's it. So...what do ya' think?
Last edited:
kreynolds
First Post
Lord Pendragon said:Wouldn't any ability, outside of those listed in the weapons' enchantments section of the DMG (such as shocking, flaming, etc.) count as the equivalent of a slotless item? Seems odd that I could, for instance, stick spell turning on my longsword instead of my ring, and get a discount to the price...
Just a thought.
The price still comes out pretty high. Remember, the cost of the power is doubled, THEN it is discounted by 10%. That's not much of a discount when the power received an initial cost increase of 100%. Try out my suggestion and create two items. You'll see what I mean.
RigaMortus
Explorer
As for a name for the bow I have a couple:
Shadow Splinter
Splinter
Shadow Splinter
Splinter
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