Hide in Plain Sight and Sniping?

[liquid]

If someone was using Hide in Plain Sight and sniped or attacked with a melee weapon and then slipped back into the shadows, does he get the -20 on his hide check reagardless of either attack he makes?

 

[Len]

This was discussed quite a bit recently. My take (playing a shadowdancer myself) is that you don't take the -20 penalty, if you take a move action to "hide in plain sight" after the attack. Under Hide it says that when sniping, the -20 is specifically "to conceal yourself after the shot", and you don't need to do that. And it says that hiding is normally part of a move action (or it's a separate move action when sniping); in either case, spending a move action lets you hide, and you can do it without seeking concealment.

 

[Abraxas]

Here are a number of links that discuss this and you can find my opinion in one or more . . .

http://www.enworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=69902&highlight=Hide+Plain+Sight
http://www.enworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=88751&highlight=Hide+Plain+Sight
http://www.enworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=87291&highlight=Hide+Plain+Sight
http://www.enworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=77761&highlight=Hide+Plain+Sight

 

[Len]

Hey, Abraxas and I have the same post count!

[Edit] Or rather we did.

 

[Abraxas]

We do again!

 

[mikebr99]

If someone was using Hide in Plain Sight and sniped or attacked with a melee weapon and then slipped back into the shadows, does he get the -20 on his hide check reagardless of either attack he makes?

Yes...
Because of:

It’s practically impossible (–20 penalty) to hide while attacking, running or charging.

Notice the "while" in there... If you are already hidden, and want to poke or shoot someone, and remain hidden the whole time, your round will consist of:

• attacking once, melee or ranged. Std. action
• hide skill check, at -20. move equiv. action.
• a 5ft. step if you want, before or after both of the above.

HiPS has no bearing on any of the above, other then removing the need for cover or concealment. If your hide check from above is successful, you never come out of hiding, so you never become "observed."

Mike

 

[Len]

HiPS has no bearing on any of the above, other then removing the need for cover or concealment.

And that removes the -20 penalty, for ranged attacks at least. Because the -20 when sniping is explicitly "to conceal yourself after the shot" but you don't need to do that.

 

[Camarath]

And that removes the -20 penalty, for ranged attacks at least. Because the -20 when sniping is explicitly "to conceal yourself after the shot" but you don't need to do that.

You would still take the "(-20 penalty) to hide while attacking".

 

[Abraxas]

Len, mikebr99 did say remain hidden the whole time, so to remain hidden while making the ranged attack you would have a -20 penalty to the hide check. From there on he and I differ in opinion

Just because I have to put in the opposing view here . . .

The Hide ability says you can hide while attacking but does not limit that to the Attack Standard Action

If your character wants to remain hidden for the entire round, even during the attack, and your character has the HiPS ability, your round would look like

Make a Full Attack as a Full Round Action
Make a Hide Check with a -20 penalty (I would actually require a Hide Check after every attack in a full round attack, but that's just me)
Take a 5' step before or after your Attack(s) if you choose

OR

Make a Single Attack as a Standard Action
Make a Hide Check with a -20 penalty
Use a Move Action

mikebr99 and I disagree on this issue and will probably never agree - use whatever fits your campaign best - both interpretations are supported by the RAW.

 

[Len]

There is a certain amount of ambiguity in all these Hide rules. I just want to make sure that Strego gets to use his Hide in Plain Sight ability sometimes.