High Diplomatic Characters

[Crothian]

I have one character in my campaign who has many feats to make her Diplomacy and Wild Empathy rolls very high. I don't want to negate these abilities but at the same time I don't want her rolling her way out of every tough situation or fight.

How have other people handled characters like this?

 

[Creamsteak]

I don't see what the problem is (following just the rules presented in the DMG of course) of having most opposition turned to a "Friendly" mentality. It just means that all uneccessary fights won't occur, and other solutions will be found. This is why many-a-villain has to be so tyranous with their lackeys, IMHO, because they have to feel like they must accomplish their missions or die.

One house rule I guess I "secretly" have, is that the PCs must treat friendly NPCs in a friendly manner, or else their relations drop.

Personally, I really enjoy games where we have "most" possible encounters resolved through developing friendly relations.

 

[Crothian]

WEll, one thing I'm worried about is theat the other PCs might get outshined. What good is the fighter if she talks their way out of most prediciments?

 

[Dirigible]

I don't want her rolling her way out of every tough situation or fight.

What good is the fighter if she talks their way out of most prediciments?

What good is a diplomat if they fight their way out of most predicaments?

 

[Seravin]

I've got a similar character in the game I'm running. I just make sure I know what the possible modifiers are to convince someone to stop fighting (or not to start).
Regardless, my players generally use an equal mix of diplomacy and violence - they like the combats. It's in the city where the diplomat really shines and the party generally just turns her loose and tells her to "find these things out" or "sell this stuff". Though when it comes to haggling, I generally use an opposed role vs. the merchant's profession skill.

The stuff I use:
If the character is rushing it (full round action), then the check is at -10 (3.5 PHB pg 72).
If the fight has already started I peg the bad guys attitude at Hostile and generally rule that the attitude has to be brought up to Friendly in order to stop the fight - of course everyone has to be able to hear and the party can't take any additional hostile actions.
If the fight hasn't started yet but almost certainly will, then the bad guys are still Hostile, but raising it to Indifferent usually staves off the fight.

Other circumstantial modifiers could apply - convincing a starving vampire-spawn not to eat you might be practically impossible (further -20 and need 10 ranks), but convincing the vampire-spawn to eat your friend instead of you might be easier...

Knowing the villains motivation really helps. Minions are probably in it for the gold and should be easier to convince that it's not worth it (although if there are more of them then the party and they haven't seen what the party could do, then is it worth their job, and maybe their life if the boss finds out?).
The main bad guys are probably motivated in continuing their current course - a helpful result may convince the badguy to alter their plans somewhat to accomodate the diplomat's safety/health/happiness, but in my mind won't usually throw away their plans completely just because a friendly person doesn't like it.

 

[green slime]

"Alas, what you say is true, but I must fight you nontheless."

 

[Li Shenron]

I have one character in my campaign who has many feats to make her Diplomacy and Wild Empathy rolls very high. I don't want to negate these abilities but at the same time I don't want her rolling her way out of every tough situation or fight.

How have other people handled characters like this?

Come on! There are so many situations where you simply can't count on those 2 abilities There are mindless creatures or creatures who don't respond to talking, creatures who don't understand your language (or don't have one) and at the same time they are not animal or magical beasts to be affected by Wil Empathy. What about Undead, Constructs, Plants, Elementals...? There are also high-Charisma creatures who may be better diplomats than your player's PC, like some Outsiders or Dragons or Feys.

Also many situations simply can't be resolved by parlay. An ambush typically starts before you have the chance to speak, and you anyway take a -10 to Diplomacy if you do it as a full-round action (otherwise it takes a minute) to change attitude. Considering that the DC to turn hostiles NPCs to Friendly is 35...

As the DM, your chance to increase the DC with circumtance modifiers is very wide, and you can come up with many reasons why a NPC won't change his attitude. Perhaps he was previously intimidated by his own master to fight against you until death, and you may rule that you actually need a Diplomacy result higher than the master's result. In this way you can prevent the players to skip an encounter you really don't want them to avoid.

That said, if your player has chosen his PC to be a top-diplomat, it is best to reward her effort often. Per the DMG you may still award XPs and they are still shared by all PCs. You will have less fights, but that simply means that your campaign will go faster

Finally, I also think that having the party resolve many encounters without fighting makes the game both more realistic and more similar to novels adventures. Especially if they are playing good characters.

 

[Deadguy]

Crothian, I think it's important to remember that there are some people (and beings) who simply cannot be swayed to serve the character's wishes. They personally might sympathise with them, but they are not acting alone. People who are part of organisations especially might be respectful of the PC but still obey the dictates of their rules or nature.

Think of a city guard captain who might actually like the new PC, and put in a word for her, but the city rules indicate that all strangers must be presented to the magistrates. Just because she's persuaded him, he still feels obliged to obey the rules (that's part of his nature), so teh PCs can't just walk away. That's not unfair to the user of Diplomacy, it's just living with the nature of the 'opposition'.

Likewise the guards sent by the BBEG might be in such fear of their master that they cannot imagine not complying with his wishes. No amount of persuasion can help here - they are genuinely much more afraid of their master than they are friendly to the new PC. (Imagine an opposed Intimidate roll, with appropriate modifiers for brutality and omniscience!)

I personally don't think that the normal uses of the Social Skills can drive a person to behave outside their own natures. So certain people are strongly enough motivated in certain areas that they are not open to persuasion. They believe in what they are doing, and no short conversation is going to persuade them otherwise. That's not unfair to the PC. After all, they would be annoyed if you decided that a persuasive NPC has convinced them to turn themselves over to the authorities, or submit to the BBEG!

 

[MarauderX]

"Evil is as evil does, no matter what you do or say, and we are about to triumph. But I like you, I'll kill you last."

 

[Moe Ronalds]

If you're worried about the PCs talking their way out of situations too easily, you could rule that they may have to make an opposed check against a bad guy's diplomacy/intimidation roll before they roll to see if they can actually make a hostile NPC friendly.

Granted, if your big bad evil guy isn't much of a talker, you're in for some trouble.