D&D 5E Hope for an open GSL?

[Mark CMG]

Yeah, you weren't really responding to me so much as adding a different subject to the mix. The Internet is to blame for B&M stores going under as well as non-business folk trying to get into retail, as Morrus points out. So, as to the statement that "a lot" of folks lost money, I stand by my previous posts.

 

[MacMathan]

When I say "a lot of people I know..." that is exactly what it means I do not intend to speak for the industry as a whole.

I have given it some more thought and here is what I have simplified it to IMO OGL is great for a Hobby that supports very few or no big players (50+ employees) and is taken care of by a myriad of small/individual entities often for free or low cost (see OSR).

The OGL as it was iterated in 3e is terrible for a Business that wants to make large amounts of money and support itself as a medium to largish for profit company.

I agree with Morrus that we will hear anything definitive on the subject for at least a year maybe more.

 

[Mark CMG]

How many employees does WotC have that have anything to do with RPGs? My impression is that the bulk of their employees work on Magic and other interests and that, on a prorated basis, even if you include a percentage of employees from other depatments it would get up to fifty. Maybe I'm wrong.

 

[MacMathan]

Hmmm good point it is hard to tell how much of the support staff (legal, marketing etc) would be required for an operation of their size if it was just D&D.

Anyone know how many Paizo has right now I would imagine at least 30 but I could be wrong.

Or TSR at its height?

 

[Kzach]

75% of game stores always go out of business. During 3E, before 3E, and now. Mainly because they' run by gamers who haven't the faintest idea how to run a shop.

This seriously can't be understated. Running a business is... a LOT more difficult than people realise. It's all la-de-da until you're in the trenches, DOING it. Then it's all the little things that, combined, form an avalanche of expenses, work, stress and customer dissatisfaction.

If it wasn't for the fact that I'm simply not suited to working for others, I'd never even consider going into business for myself... again.

The good ones tend to survive.

I wish. Unless by 'good', you mean remotely business savvy.

 

[Darwinism]

Open licenses are a horrible idea; not just for the financials of a company, but because they literally allow any idiot with a convert-to-PDF function on their favored editor to churn out horrible content that is automatically sanctioned by the license.

I'd much rather a restricted license than one that allows another Black Tokyo.

 

[Mark CMG]

Open licenses are a horrible idea; not just for the financials of a company, (. . .)

As has been pointed out many places, the OGL and the d20 System License seemed to be in part responsible for the biggest boom period of D&D in the last decade and a half.

(. . .) but because they literally allow any idiot with a convert-to-PDF function on their favored editor to churn out horrible content that is automatically sanctioned by the license.

I'd much rather a restricted license than one that allows another Black Tokyo.

Tastes being a relative thing, and although the product you mention isn't in my own wheelhouse, you seem to have chosen one that got some decent reviews and illustrates one of the benefits of the OGL in that it allows products of many stripes to reach the market that might not otherwise have seen the light of day. Whether or not they gain traction is then up to their own strengths and weaknesses.


But, again, the OGL already exists and isn't going away so that sort of muddies your arguement. The only real question you seem to inadvertently raise is whether or not D&D should return to a strategy that allows it to rise to the heights at saw in the early part of the new century. Claiming that it is bad for financials seems to fly in the face of actual evidence.

 

[Blackwarder]

There is a good chance that I already said this before in this thread but if I did I was a long time ago so here it is and please forgive me if you read this before.

I think that WotC should adapt an app store like model, where side by side with its own products 3rd party developers could sell their products.

Couple that with digital tools that will allow the players/DMs to incorporate 3rd party developers products bellow the hood with minimal user input (you bought the book? It automatically upload the relevant stuff to your account and can be used with the character builder/monster builder/advanture builder) and IMO its a winner.

That same model would also be a platform for the every day player and DM to share and sell their own stuff, artist could sell character portraits, DMs could sell nifty advantures or even a copy of the map their players drew while exploring a dungeon (a cool handout to give other players who bought a map of the dungeon before going inside).

The store (let's call it the "Wizards Bazaar" or WB for short) should be easy to navigate with tabs for grogordnia, rule modules, settings, maps etc. With clearly marked professional and amateur content.

But more importantly, I think that it will be best to bring all the different products under the same roof, if only to make sure that every thing is at the tips of the consumer, I don't want to have to go through several different sites to find what I want for my game, I'd rather have one source to go to and know that if I bought it once I can download it forever and it's compatible with all the online tools that I use daily.

One thing I forgot, I think that each digital tool should be connected to the book it relates to, buying the PHB will give you the the character builder with only the stuff in the PHB, MM will give you a monster builder with only the monsters in that MM and any kind of advanture builder will be linked to the DMG. Once the user buy somthing related to one of the tools, for example a book full of speciality clerics, than that info will be seamlessly integrated to that tool.

Warder

 

[trancejeremy]

Open licenses are a horrible idea; not just for the financials of a company, but because they literally allow any idiot with a convert-to-PDF function on their favored editor to churn out horrible content that is automatically sanctioned by the license.

I'd much rather a restricted license than one that allows another Black Tokyo.

I think what the OGL and d20 license produced was a bubble. People who got in early did well, those that came later probably not unless they were sharp at business.

And personally, I'd much rather buy a product written by any given idiot with a convert to PDF function than the soulless corporate pap churned out by WOTC and some of the other larger existing companies that took advantage of the licenses.

Indeed, that was ultimately the problem with the d20 movement - the companies that could flood the market with books every month pushed all the smaller press stuff out.

I mean, how many of those Legends &Lairs Hardcovers did FFG put out? Probably 20-30. And AEG did the same with their one word sourcebooks (War, Evil, Undead, etc) and then Mongoose had their Quintessential splatbooks and Classic Play line once they got going.

Green Ronin was the only company that had any sort of consistent quality that put out stuff on a regular basis (though they didn't pump 'em out like FFG or AEG).

By contrast, the small presses that only put out a few books usually did produce something really interesting. Maybe not great art, or editing, but great ideas.

 

[Nylanfs]

However, if the 600 pound gorilla, fully supported by the OGL couldn't save the B&M gaming store, then it's safe to say that the gaming store simply couldn't have been saved at all.

Which rolls right back around to my original point of, does the OGL actually matter?

That's the thing, WotC after 3E launched and the first couple of layoffs, They in no-way supported the OGL. The only book that had ANY OGL material besides the SRD material from the PHB, DMG, MM, & Epic Handbook was Unearthed Arcana (or Arcana Unearthed, can never remember which one was WotC's).

They didn't use ANY OGL material from other publishers and didn't release any additional material into the SRD.

I can understand the reasoning for for not releasing more material into the SRD, but they could have used some of the truly innovative materials from the third parties.