how close to the rules do you play? poll #5 (cr,el)

[alsih2o]

how closely do you follow the cr and el suggestions?

 

[CRGreathouse]

I like the idea of CRs and ELs. However, the PCs will encounter whatever's there -- they went through a dungeon with monsters of CR 4 below party level, and they've had to deal with one with CR 16 higher. (Fortunately, the latter was receptive to diplomacy and the PCs didn't attack.)

 

[Henry]

My answer is a combo of #2 and #3. Mostly I stay within +2 or -2 EL of the group's level, but last week I faced up bunch of 5th level characters with a Beholder. Before you think me mad, there were 10 characters in the group at the time, including 4 NPC's of higher level than the PC's, and one thing about EL's that don't scale well is when there are FAR more characters than the opposition. Only one character died (and 2 NPC's), and the beholder lasted a grand total of 3 rounds. The moral of the story? Make friends wherever you find them. The second moral? Don't wander where high-level adventurers fear to tread.

But by and large, the CR system works well, and we stick to it.

 

[diaglo]

i make the world. i add the monsters. it is up to the players to decide which battles they choose to fight. and which ones are best left alone.

edit: of course, i drop a thousand hints along the way.

 

[Gothmog]

I'm with the CR and EL are crap camp. They are not objective or accurate measurements at all- they all depend on circumstances, party composition, equipment, etc. I just throw what makes sense for the adventure at the party, and let them worry if they can handle it or not. Oddly enough, the group seems to have a good grasp of what they can and can't handle, and will retreat after a few rounds if things look too tough. I have routinely seen encounters with a CR 2-3 lower decimate a group, and ones with CRs 2-3 higher be a cakewalk, so those numbers aren't even close to accurate. Don't even get me started on basing XP off those wonky CRs- its insane. My solution was to igore the CRs except as a VERY general guide to how tough a monster is, and base XP off roleplaying and problem solving instead of overcoming obstacles/monsters.

 

[Wombat]

The whole CR/EL thing looks fantastic on paper, but plays out terribly.

If a party does not have the Iconic Four, the entire encounter will play out far tougher or weaker than indicated by the CR/EL ratings; equally at high and especially at Epic levels, the CR/ELs become a farce -- if you have exactly the right material and skills, the monster is dead; if not, the party is dead.

I look upon the CR as a vague guideline, but only vague.

 

[shilsen]

I voted 2, since most of my group's encounters will be close to the appropriate CR. But that depends a lot on their actions. I've told them that I use status quo encounters, so if they decide to go after a great wyrm at 10th lvl or attack a bunch of garden variety kobolds at 15th, they're free to do so. Also, they know I'm pretty good at running foes as smart as they should be and being creative in combat, so sometimes an encounter can be a lot more trouble than one would expect.

 

[kigmatzomat]

My answer is a combo of #2 and #3. Mostly I stay within +2 or -2 EL of the group's level, but last week I faced up bunch of 5th level characters with a Beholder. Before you think me mad, there were 10 characters in the group at the time, including 4 NPC's of higher level than the PC's, and one thing about EL's that don't scale well is when there are FAR more characters than the opposition.

Actually it does fine, you just have to alter your target EL. My group has 6PCs and 1 NPC, all within 1 level of each other. This means I generally shoot for an EL of party level+2 as my baseline.

With a group of mixed levels, one way to find the party's EL is calculate their CR as an opponent and subtract 4. So if your group was six 5th level PCs + 4 7th level npcs, it would be CR12 for an EL8. Which against an EL8 should include a noticeable party kill but with a chance of victory. If the NPCs were higher the odds get better.

 

[frankthedm]

Only reason why i dislike CR is that It leads to rigged fights the PC's are expected to win. Its pretty good for spot checking what normal parties might be capable of handling. but a flying, will save tossing critter would, of course, decimate a group of ground-pounding meaty melee'ers.

 

[Buttercup]

Unless I'm running a game for an iconic party, I don't have a great deal of confidence in the CR/EL crap. Some parties are so light on melee that when they're level one a group of two kobalds could wipe them out. This same party might turn into an incinerator with legs 6 levels later, if they survive, of course.
And what if you're running a game for a party of 7? Then I think it's much harder to judge. As I've mentioned elsewhere, my group had been cutting down enemies like a hot knife through buttah until last session, when I had to resort to massive fudging to save them from the fickle dice (and probably also from an encounter that was too tough).

So yeah, CR/EL is of limited utility.