How do YOU play a bard?

[Sejs]

"Well, OK. (sigh) I suppose I could hum some sort of blessing thingy as we march off to our doom... La dee da dee da whatever ..." (Perform skill +23 ranks, +4 for an 18 Charisma, +3 for feat, +etc. -- HAH!) "I guess if we're gonna die, it might as well be with a smile, huh? Anyone feel better yet?"

Heh, reminds me of Xan the depressed enchanter from Baldur's Gate. "Why don't we all just do ourselves a big favor and lie down here and die." I loved that guy.

That is, if I wanted to shoot for someone based on Chaucer - a poet and laureate.

Rousing speeches and rhythmic chants works as bardic music just as well as playing a fiddle or a harmonica. Once more into the breach, dear friends, once more;

Even if it's musical it doesn't have to seem out of place. I've had a bard who's staple for inspire courage was humming the music for 'the men go marching one by one'. It's classic cadence music, easy to remember, and doesn't seem out of place in a fight.


Heh, as for it being "the +1 song" ... after 14th level with Harmony running, all of a sudden it's "the +6 song". Or, alternatly, "the free power attack song". Folks don't forget that as easily.

 

[der_kluge]

Double post.

 

[Crothian]

The Bard is and has always been my favorite class bar none. Unfortunately, I think the last good book about bards was the second edition Complete Bard. I played one bard in third edcition and he did go from 1st-20th level. THere area few good feats for a Bard, that was my first complaint. Song and Silence had a few but mostly I felt that there just are not good options for the bard.

 

[Kahuna Burger]

And I suspect that if you tried to duplicate such a thing in a movie, audiences would look at each other and go "why is that guy singing while his friends are being stabbed to death? I thought he was their friend?"

on an introduction to a new group I played a useless princess until my real character could be introduced... in a fight the bard started a inspire courage and before the first round was up, my princess grabbed him by the shoulders, shook him and yelled "Stop singing, you idiot, we're in the middle of a fight!"

But seriously, its a supernatural effect. A movie would have to work hard to portray that, just like it would be hard to explain why the cleric guy spending crucial time waving his arms and shouting his god's blessing is actually more helpful than picking up his mace and HITTING SOMETHING... The fact that something would be hard to show in a movie doesn't effect its viablity to the game in roleplay or anything else... The actual just standing around and singing part doesn't take much longer than casting bless, then they are shooting or swinging but still being inspiring.

When I have singing bards, I envision them performing that "do you hear the people sing" part from Les Miserables - a rousing inspirational song talking about exactly the vital fight happening right then. As I meantioned above, my current bard is more oratory based and shouts encouragement to her allies and declares the evil nature of their foes.

All roleplaying aside, I agree with those who say the class is mechanicly weak. The rogue can do everything "bardic" but the knowlege gig better, the spells are weak, and combat ability is a joke. But I like the idea of the bard so much I keep trying.

Kahuna Burger

 

[der_kluge]

I don't ask my clerics to know even first aid in real life, nor my wizard players to study witchcraft. I don't ask my fighters to know real fencing, nor my rogues to walk a tightrope before I let them in my game. I surely don't ask them to actually do these things personally during game play.

Well - same with Bards.

So, in your game, let's say it's a 20th level game, and the party has to rally the kingdom's army to fight a great war.

Player: "My bard will deliver a rousing speech to the masses to inspire them to fight the demons.
Emiricol: Roll a perform check.
Player: *rolls an 18" "Awesome, so I've got +26 ranks after everything is added, so I got a total of a 44. Kick ass!"
Emiricol: Ok, so the army is excited, and heads off into war.

Come on!

Bards are different! They're a different can of worms altogether. I wouldn't ask my player to actually walk a tightrope or pick a lock to convey what he is trying to do in the game. We can all envision that pretty regularly. But, for the bard to inspire courage, or rally the troops, or quell a rebellion, or whatever - with a meager dice roll? That seems so bland to me.

 

[James Heard]

My favorite (if only) bard character was based more upon his ability to use Gather Information out of combat and his storytelling. For combat I don't think I ever used a song more than once or twice, but then again I took the Master of None tag a bit seriously and that character was dipping single levels into Cleric, Fighter, Rogue, and Wizard. In the end I think I could do just about anything, but mostly I could annoy the rest of the party by knocking off offhand applications of my Bardic knowledge at the drop of the hat (I used it for snatching useless gossip about the barmaids and the other PCs relatives), sweet talking priests for favors that the clerics would have to go on quests for, and basically being a complete know-it-all. I placed my high stats in Intelligence, Charisma, and Dexterity; in that order, and sacked my wisdom and other pansy stats. I was a lover, not a fighter. I was awful at fighting, healing, tossing spells, and just about everything combat oriented. However if I had a wand I could do just about ANYTHING. One of the coolest things about bards is that you really aren't losing anything by dipping elsewhere, bard spells and special abilities just aren't terribly exciting except that you can do them in the first place.

 

[der_kluge]

The Bard is and has always been my favorite class bar none. Unfortunately, I think the last good book about bards was the second edition Complete Bard. I played one bard in third edcition and he did go from 1st-20th level. THere area few good feats for a Bard, that was my first complaint. Song and Silence had a few but mostly I felt that there just are not good options for the bard.

All right, Crothian. If we play together at GenCon, I want to see you play a Bard. I've only met one other person play a good bard, and he was nearly a bard in real life, so it wasn't much of a stretch.

Did you feel like the Bard was viable all the way to 20th level? I assume this was a 3.0 Bard?

I would think at 20th level a bard (3.0 especially) would be totally outclassed by the rogue in skills, outmatched by the casters with magic, and outgunned by the fighters in combat. So, unless it was a high role-playing, lots of social interactions kind of game, the bard would be just completely useless on most counts.

 

[Shadowdancer]

I'm actually a little shy and introverted IRL, but I enjoy playing a bard. It's a liberating experience to play someone very different from myself. Sort of like many actors who enjoy playing characters very different from themselves. The key is not becoming self-consciouse about it. Alcohol helps.

The players in our group know that in combat, I'll help out however I can, but they are going to have to shoulder the brunt of the work. But in social situations, they all just say, "Let the bard handle it" or "Let the bard talk to them."

 

[der_kluge]

My favorite (if only) bard character was based more upon his ability to use Gather Information out of combat and his storytelling. For combat I don't think I ever used a song more than once or twice, but then again I took the Master of None tag a bit seriously and that character was dipping single levels into Cleric, Fighter, Rogue, and Wizard.

How fascinating. So, you actually made a "jack-of-all-trades" by literally being a jack of all trades? In that, you actually took levels of everything you could get your hands on!

What an interesting idea. Finally, a reason to take a bunch of classes that doesn't have a powergaming basis behind it!

I wonder how a Rog5/Ftr5/Wiz10 would compare to a 20th level Bard? (ignoring the lack of the musical ability)

 

[jerichothebard]

Alternatively, if you were to *remove* the musical aspect of the bard class, what would be a suitable replacement?

That is, if I wanted to shoot for someone based on Chaucer - a poet and laureate.

Speaking of which, go rent A Knight's Tale and watch it for Jeff (Geoffrey Chaucer)'s parts as the herald and writer. Bard class all the way, and not a lute in sight.

And you can't tell me that his stirring "introductions" did not inspire Sir William...

as for how I play a bard character, I very rarely use the musical effects. Jericho (who is a bard/cleric) uses a wand of inflict moderate as a melee weapon, and has seriously pumped ranks into bluff, intimidate, and gather information. He's a total player, too.

I'm actually focusing more on the cleric part nowadays, but it has been fun playing the conflicting motivations - one part of the character really just wants to sing in bars and drink ale and get laid a lot, but the other part of him realizes that he has a calling from the god that he cannot ignore, and that the world is going to heck in a handmaiden...er... something like that...

I suspect you would include me in your category of "really outgoing, funny, bombastic people that are just really fun to be around." At least, some of the time.

jtb