D&D 5E (2024) How do you rule using a Hand Crossbow with a nick weapon

[UngeheuerLich]

Sure, if you don't like that, that's up to you! But it seems pretty clear to me that that is the RAI.

What seems clear to you is not.

If that was the intend, why not just write: "A weapon with the loading property can only be fired once per turn."?

 

[Plaguescarred]

As UngeheuerLich say, a non Crossbow Expert can still attack 2+ on a turn with a Loading weapon, for exemple attacking with a Hand Crossbow, and then attacking again with another Action such as Action Surge.

Likewise, a non Crossbow Expert can attack with a Hand Crossbow, unequip it, use a Free Item Interaction to equip a different Hand Crossbow and attack with it as a Bonus Action.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

The Crossbow Expert feat specifically let you load a piece of ammunition into it even if you lack a free hand.

I always find that one funny - how, exactly?

 

[Charlaquin]

I always find that one funny - how, exactly?

The only thing I can imagine is you hold whatever is occupying that hand between your index finger and thumb, draw the hand crossbow bolt between your middle and ring fingers (near the second knuckle), and use the tips of your middle, ring, and pinky fingers to pull back the string of the hand crossbow.

Seems very silly, but I can just imagine it working enough not to bother house ruling crossbow expert to work sensibly. Especially since I know most people who want to use hand crossbows want dual-wield them for some reason.

 

[Plaguescarred]

I always find that one funny - how, exactly?

It isn't specified by the feat so your guess is as good as mine

I could easily picture a Crossbow Expert putting the crossbow between it's legs or under an arm, reload with the hand before picking it up again.

 

[Rainbow Scissors]

I'm not sure I understand your question. It's "or". Here's the full text.

"You can fire only one piece of ammunition from a Loading weapon when you use an action, a Bonus Action, or a Reaction to fire it, regardless of the number of attacks you can normally make." Doesn't matter how many attacks you can make normally.

If, however, you had a feature that allowed you to make an attack without taking any actions at all (not even a Reaction), then that would circumvent this because it doesn't meet the trigger (it isn't being fired when you use an action, a Bonus Action, or a Reaction.) I know of no such feature, so it's not like this is an exploitable loophole. It's just an interesting note that it isn't tied to whether you fire the crossbow--it's tied to the type of action you used in order to fire it.

If you were holding multiple loading weapons, do you get a once per round use for each individual weapon?

 

[FitzTheRuke]

The only thing I can imagine is you hold whatever is occupying that hand between your index finger and thumb, draw the hand crossbow bolt between your middle and ring fingers (near the second knuckle), and use the tips of your middle, ring, and pinky fingers to pull back the string of the hand crossbow.

Seems very silly, but I can just imagine it working enough not to bother house ruling crossbow expert to work sensibly. Especially since I know most people who want to use hand crossbows want dual-wield them for some reason.

It seems a lot easier to imagine if it is a property of the crossbow itself (like a repeating crossbow) - It's one of my few (major) disappointments with 5e - I find the equipment part of the game to be very unfortunately lacking. But then, I'd be happy for a vast increase in complexity for the rules of equipment - both mundane and magical, but mostly mundane - in exchange for a simplification of spellcasting.

But that might just be me. Well, it's not likely that it's just me, but we might be a minority.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Yes, but only if you make a ranged attack. For melee attack, the Attack Action can also let you equip it before the attack as well.

If the extra attack of the Light property is a Dagger melee attack as a Bonus Action, then the Free Item Interaction would be needed to draw it before attacking.

Bottom line is that the Hand Crossbow and the Dagger need not be both wielded before taking the Attack Action, as confirmed by Sage Advice Compendium;

So here's the thing- not to add complication to what you're claiming, but look at what the Sage Advice compendium is actually saying- it's not exactly what you are saying.

Can I make an attack with a Light weapon, then draw a second weapon with my other hand and qualify to make the extra attack of the Light property?​

Yes. The only requirement for the Light property’s extra attack is that it’s made with a different Light weapon.

The question itself is limited. Technically, all that it is asking is:
If I have a weapon in one hand that is light, and attack with it, can I then draw a second weapon (that is light) with my other hand and attack with it?

That's actually already easy to answer.

Attack action gives you one (ONE!) free equip/unequip. Attack action is attack with light weapon. Free equip of second light weapon in the other hand. That triggers (condition) bonus action. That's all good!


What that doesn't address is a lot of other issues- as I alluded to previously, a lot of confusion comes up in the "free object interaction" (you get to interact with one object that is part of the environment for free).

Now here is where I stand, and I am sure you will disagree.

Utilize [Action]
You normally interact with an object while doing something else, such as when you draw a sword as part of the Attack action. When an object requires an action for its use, you take the Utilize action.

When I read the rules in pari materia, I don't think that you get the "free" equip of the attack AND a free object interaction. Because:
a. Specific (in the attack action) beats general (something in the environment).
b. Because the free object interaction points you to "utilize," and utilize specifically references drawing a sword as part of the attack action and not the utilize action.

In other words, you don't get "one free equip/unequip as attack, plus one free floating equip/unequip." I think that the rules, together, are that you get a free object interaction that isn't equipping or unequipping your weapons when you do an attack, because that's covered by the specific rules regarding the attack action.

But don't let me rain on your parade. If and when there is a Sage Advice that really delves into advanced weapon juggling, I'm sure it will be interesting.

 

[Plaguescarred]

The Free Item Interaction let you interact with one object or feature of the environment for free, during either your move or action. And Weapons are objects. So you can interact with one weapon for free during a move or action. This general rule is in addition to specific rules such as the Attack Action Equip/Unequip, the Ammunition or Thrown property letting you interact with objects in additional ways.

As a matter of fact, the Free Item Interaction is the only way to equip or unequip a weapon without attacking or using the Attack Action.

 

[Charlaquin]

Frankly, I think it’s stupid that the rules treat interacting with the environment as a distinct type of thing you can do on your turn that requires restricting the number of times it can be done. If it needs to be part of some action anyway, just let it be part of that action. Draw a weapon when you attack with it. Uncork a potion when you drink it. Open a door when you move through it - heck, let’s go bananas and let you close it behind you too! I don’t see why any of these things need to be restricted independent of the restrictions that already exist on moving and taking actions.