How is D&D of any edition realistic?

[Fifth Element]

For me the problem with 4e is not that it is less realistic (whatever that means in the context of fantasy) it is that it is less internally consistant than any previous edition of D&D.

I think you'll have to be more specific here. Many people would argue exactly the opposite (for instance, hit points representing more than just physical damage, yet requiring magical healing to recover them).

 

[Fifth Element]

I'm convinced that 4E would be distinctly less satisfying to me when it came to the time spent on world building.

Why? It seems to me that world-building is largely edition-neutral.

This makes me a close minded "hater".

Nope, that's not it. Must be something else.

 

[BryonD]

Why? It seems to me that world-building is largely edition-neutral.

You'll probably get a better answer from Mearls.

 

[jdrakeh]

Can you give specific examples?

I already have. Am I willing to go out of my way to find more because you can't be bothered to look for them yourself? Well. . .

KarinsDad's saying dnd cannot simulate but still model many real life aspects as well as fantasy is hardly conclusive. It's definitely not claiming "dnd is realistic" or "dedicated to accurate historical recreation" or "modeling of Earth's physics" anyway.

It does not claim the second thing, granted, though it very specifically claims the first and the last things. KarinsDad very specifically mentions Gravity and Wind, then states:

"The argument that DND does not simulate these well does not mean that it does not model them."

His very argument is, in fact, that D&D does model Earth's physics, though not necessarily well. He further goes on to give behavior of Fire as an example of a thing in D&D that models real life physics, realistically. And states:

DND is a model of the real world combined with a model of a magical world.

Emphasis mine. He doesn't say that it's a magic world that borrows from the real world. He asserts that it is, in fact, a model of the real world to which magical elements have been added. Or, specifically, that D&D models the real world by default. And, as previously noted, it's not a bad argument if you're looking only at those specific things.

That said. . . No. No, I absolutely do not have time to dig up more examples for you. There are several very specific references to real life physics being modeled by D&D in the cited post, as well as the very clear assertion that D&D itself models the real world by default and then adds magical elements after the fact.

If you're willing to ignore those very specific examples and arguments made on behalf of D&D as a physics engine, that's all well and good -- however, it also makes clear that you will ignore any further examples of such argument that I search out, making the endeavor a complete and total waste of my time.

 

[Fifth Element]

You'll probably get a better answer from Mearls.

Why? Has Mr. Mearls made a similar claim?

 

[BryonD]

Why? Has Mr. Mearls made a similar claim?

Yes. He stated at some point, a while back (nope, can't give a link), that if you like world building, 4E would probably have less appeal to you.

 

[Fifth Element]

Yes. He stated at some point, a while back (nope, can't give a link), that if you like world building, 4E would probably have less appeal to you.

Okay, I do vaguely recall that now. But if you take him on his word for that, why can't you take him on his word that 4E is better than 3E?

 

[jdrakeh]

And on a completely unrelated note I'm pretty sure that the odds of survive a long fall have to be better that 1 in a million since I suspect less than a million people have fallen thousands of feet and yet I can think of 3 people off the top of my head who survived falls from airplanes. One was basically uninjured.

I actually think that they're worse than what I hypothesized earlier, given that roughly 13,322 people a year die from falls of less than 60 feet in distance (per the National Safety Council) and that proportionately few people in recorded history have survived a fall of more than 100 feet relatively intact.

But don't take my word for it.

This is actually a very good example of the "I've heard of a few documented cases, therefore it must be a common occurance" leap in deductive reasoning that I mentioned earlier in the the thread. If you stop and think about it, logically, even a hundred or so suvivors in the whole of recorded history isn't very many survivors.

I'd imagine that the odds for survival are actually far worse than 1:1,000,000 -- though you're welcome to jump out of a plane sans parachute to test your theory

[Edit: On a related note, if you're falling onto a non-solid surface, it seems that skill may play a role in diminishing damage -- but only up to a point.]

 

[A'koss]

Even Mearls stated something to the effect that if you liked world building then this version would likely be less appealing to you.

I'd like to know where you heard that, I don't recall hearing anything along those lines myself. I don't see how 4e is going to make world-building any more difficult than it was in 3e. Building a world is building a world and I don't see what obstacles 4e specifically is putting in the path of that.

Something I touched on this earlier, I think it's important to note that 4e opens up a broader range of styles of play with it being fairly easy to modify for lower magic settings (which is more in line with a lot of the styles of fantasy we grew up with). I think it'll prove to be a boon to setting design over the previous editions...

 

[hong]

For me the problem with 4e is not that it is less realistic (whatever that means in the context of fantasy) it is that it is less internally consistant than any previous edition of D&D. A lack of internal consistancy disrupts my sense of immersion. It's that simple.

And on a completely unrelated note I'm pretty sure that the odds of survive a long fall have to be better that 1 in a million since I suspect less than a million people have fallen thousands of feet and yet I can think of 3 people off the top of my head who survived falls from airplanes. One was basically uninjured.

QED.