how to convince people that D&D is not evil

[Corvidae]

why would the thread be closed werk?

It isnt discussing politics or religion, and Morrus' Grandma is more than welcome

John

 

[Harmon]

The real problem is that evil is subjective.

It is, to that you are right, but somethings are evil completely and without question.

Some people think alcohol is evil.

My post might be read that I think its evil, but I do not. Things happened that I can not talk about, those things happened, and they were evil. Why did I make booze seem that I think its evil? Because I can't talk about the real evil that occured during that time.

I just don't want to be misunderstood, that is why I am replying here.

 

[Corvidae]

Just a thought, but maybe the "good" side of society is as misunderstood as gamers are. I mean, they get stats used against them as much as anyone does. One example would be that Catholic priest have a lower child molestation percentage than almost any other group. Granted it should be none, but it is still a stat used like D&D players are serial killers.

Yeah, there are some closed minded people, but I think that gamers, as being pushed around by closed minded people should not be closed minded in themselves.

I am glad that gaming helped you get out of a bad situation.

John

 

[Thotas]

Those folks above who say that you should hand over the book to the accusers and challenge them "the evil" are on to something, but they aren't going far enough. Even the name of this thread contains the real problem you're having here.

"How to convince ..."? Baloney. If I have to have this discussion with anyone, I merely point out that I know a great deal about D&D, and they know nothing. I'm the expert, so if they expect to tell me it's evil, they'll need to prove it. The onus of proof is not on me, it's not on you, it's on the claimant. I only have to convince them if they're the ones who are right by default. The claimant is not right by default; so they have to convince me.

If it sounds like I'm less than diplomatic when I deal with this matter, I admit, I'm not. I spell it out and let them know until they have the proof, I don't have time to waste on their nonsense.

 

[Mercule]

I am one of those religious conservatives

Ditto. My dad finally got over it when I told him that I probably wouldn't be a Christian w/o D&D. Why? Because it got me to actually study history and real world mystical beliefs (including early Christianity) to add depth to my campaign. During that process, I came to faith in Christ. Otherwise, I'd probably be a deist or agnostic.

 

[Halivar]

The question of "what is evil" is somewhat dogmatic and off-topic (people believe what they believe, period). The challenge is not convincing conservative Christians that their whole intellectual framework is wrong (that's a flame-war followed by a thread-lock); the challenge is convincing anyone, whether they be Jack T. Chick or Jack Thompson (of Rockstar lawsuit fame), that D&D fits just fine into their intellectual framework as it is.

Of course, some people will be dogmatic about D&D being evil, just like some folks in the past have been about cards and dancing. You can't do anything about them; live with them, humor them, and wait them out. The next generation will "get it" if they don't.

 

[Harmon]

DELETED BY REL

Ya, I think that last paragraph gets a little close to the “religious” area of do’s and do nots on EN so I won’t go any further out of respect.

I have met a few dozen gamers in the last twenty odd years- none of them worshiped Satan or made sacrifices to any Gods, and never have I seen a gamer casting a spell (speaking in tongues and tossing components about). If I did see anyone worshipping some demon or devil I would take them out back for a thrashing. If I saw anyone “casting a spell,” they would be gone from my table or I would be gone from theirs cause they aren’t stable.

Take care, and peace all.

 

[Rackhir]

Ditto. My dad finally got over it when I told him that I probably wouldn't be a Christian w/o D&D. Why? Because it got me to actually study history and real world mystical beliefs (including early Christianity) to add depth to my campaign. During that process, I came to faith in Christ. Otherwise, I'd probably be a deist or agnostic.

I find this interesting because I wound up an agnostic (later becoming an atheist) through much the same sort of experiences (studying history and real world religious beliefs). But that sort of thing might be a good topic for a forked thread on Circus Maximus.

 

[Raylis]

I dont think you should try to convince your parents what D&D is, a better solution would be to show them what it is (as suggested earlier). Explaining what will go on in a session, showing them the books etc. may help change your parents minds. I'd also suggest some not-as-well-known good parts of D&D:

It helps build math skills and reinforce basic math
It introduces the mathematical concept of probability
It encourages creativity and problem solving skills ect (Scott Kurtz did a really good (IMO) write up of skills D&D helps to build and reinforce, under the rants section on pvponline.com).

If you go for more of the "show and tell" angle vs. the "changing your minds" angle they may be more willing to A) listen and B) let your brothers play too.

Just my two coppers.

 

[Corvidae]

It is ok Harmon,
I found myself venturing a bit too close to the religious side of things.

I guess I wonder, how do you convince someone, regardless of what they believe, using logic and examples that it is not evil.

So far it seems the give them the book thing is winning out.

I also wanted to see peoples experiances and reactions, so anything else anyone wants to share is welcome.

John