Iosue
Legend
どういたしまして。さて、本来の話題に戻りましょう！Wakarimashita, Arigato Gozaimasu. (said in a friendly, non-condescending, way).
D&D 5E How We Beat the HD, HotDQ, Spoilers
- Thread starter KarinsDad
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Wrathamon
Adventurer
I agree
Iosue
Legend
Many have tried in good faith to explain to you why they don't feel that way. If you aren't quite getting it, it's probably because you keep posting, uh, stuff like the below.
Wrathamon
Adventurer
I dont mind losing in a dramatic fashion. I dont like loosing when I feel the DM is just trying to pick on me and kill me just because I am killing his monsters.
In this instance, I probably would not have been upset. I would have been like ouch I bit off more than I can chew.
I know this because I have fought against stupid odds knowing that we were going to loose, and still had fun going out in a blaze of glory. I am a player that sits pretty much in the middle of the sport and story camps of roleplaying. I
Only times I get upset at the LOSE is in situations like when the DM decided that the enemies no longer deal average damage to just my character, but started rolling against only my character and the decided to just do average +1 so he can do more damage to me because I had Heavy Armor Master feat and tended to focus fire on me was more upsetting. I would have preferred to go fight the 1/2 dragon knowing that it was at least a fair fight
In this instance, I probably would not have been upset. I would have been like ouch I bit off more than I can chew.
I know this because I have fought against stupid odds knowing that we were going to loose, and still had fun going out in a blaze of glory. I am a player that sits pretty much in the middle of the sport and story camps of roleplaying. I
Only times I get upset at the LOSE is in situations like when the DM decided that the enemies no longer deal average damage to just my character, but started rolling against only my character and the decided to just do average +1 so he can do more damage to me because I had Heavy Armor Master feat and tended to focus fire on me was more upsetting. I would have preferred to go fight the 1/2 dragon knowing that it was at least a fair fight
It's Friday and wine (and curry but mostly wine) has been involved but I think that this article linked from the General RP thread has some relevance to this.http://johnwickpresents.com/games/game-designs/chess-is-not-an-rpg-the-illusion-of-game-balance/
The theme he keeps coming back to is “How does this rule help me tell stories?” But he's looking at the mechanics of specific RPGs.
I think that our problem here lies in two facets of this. The first is that some people are being presented with the wrong story as far as they are concerned. This has a share of the blame between bad DMing and bad design. A good DM will (not can, will) make a bad scenario work. Those of us who can remember the bulk of the Judges Guild material will have an opinion on that.
The second is that some people aren't playing a role playing game, they are playing a board game against unfair odds. And to them the story isn't as imporant as the outcome, which should be a leveled character, a succesful character. The problem for me is that that isn't a character, it's a counter.
IMO it's a very good piece on playing RPGs, games in general and the difference between them. Consider him bookmarked.
The theme he keeps coming back to is “How does this rule help me tell stories?” But he's looking at the mechanics of specific RPGs.
I think that our problem here lies in two facets of this. The first is that some people are being presented with the wrong story as far as they are concerned. This has a share of the blame between bad DMing and bad design. A good DM will (not can, will) make a bad scenario work. Those of us who can remember the bulk of the Judges Guild material will have an opinion on that.
The second is that some people aren't playing a role playing game, they are playing a board game against unfair odds. And to them the story isn't as imporant as the outcome, which should be a leveled character, a succesful character. The problem for me is that that isn't a character, it's a counter.
IMO it's a very good piece on playing RPGs, games in general and the difference between them. Consider him bookmarked.
shamsael
First Post
My fighter (with the feat that gives combat maneuvers and a d6 superiority die) had just reached 2nd level before the Half Dragon offered his challenge. Both me and the dragon rolled a lot of misses, but I eventually won out.
My character is a duelist by nature. I accepted the challenge, since it seemed the Half Dragon was a terrible negotiator (wait, you'll give me what I want if I accept the duel? I don't even have to win?). I was expecting to lose, but I was also hoping that his challenge to fight to the "last man standing" would have allowed my comrades to stabilize and heal me when the fight was over. Instead, through sheer luck, I whooped his half dragon ass.
I had the dueling fighting style, with a Rapier. I usually keep my left hand empty but my group insisted that I'm allowed to use a shield and still get the +2 damage, so I decided to take one for that fight. +5/1d8+5 rapier, AC 18 (scale mail, shield, +2 for 16 dex) and 22 hit points.
My character is a duelist by nature. I accepted the challenge, since it seemed the Half Dragon was a terrible negotiator (wait, you'll give me what I want if I accept the duel? I don't even have to win?). I was expecting to lose, but I was also hoping that his challenge to fight to the "last man standing" would have allowed my comrades to stabilize and heal me when the fight was over. Instead, through sheer luck, I whooped his half dragon ass.
I had the dueling fighting style, with a Rapier. I usually keep my left hand empty but my group insisted that I'm allowed to use a shield and still get the +2 damage, so I decided to take one for that fight. +5/1d8+5 rapier, AC 18 (scale mail, shield, +2 for 16 dex) and 22 hit points.
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Tommy Brownell
First Post
FWIW, the idea of using the lightning breath for the Half-Dragon never occurred to me, given everything written about his sense of honor. He agreed to a one on one duel to the death with the monk in the group. If there were no shenanigans, he planned to see that through. There were no shenanigans (because he won initiative and chopped him down).
If the rest of the group had charged the kobolds like they had discussed? He prolly woulda fried somebody. When the monk was captured sneaking around the Cult camp in session 2 (he slipped up badly while working in the mess tent and sent up some red flags in the cult), his second encounter with the half-dragon was very tense but interesting...and not a combat encounter, because right now the PCs are convinced that he's about the scariest dude walking the planet.
If the rest of the group had charged the kobolds like they had discussed? He prolly woulda fried somebody. When the monk was captured sneaking around the Cult camp in session 2 (he slipped up badly while working in the mess tent and sent up some red flags in the cult), his second encounter with the half-dragon was very tense but interesting...and not a combat encounter, because right now the PCs are convinced that he's about the scariest dude walking the planet.
Wrathamon
Adventurer
You got super lucky.
He just needs to hit you twice and he just needs to roll 12(?) or higher or he takes you out with 1 breath. He also crits on a 19.
AC is only 1 higher, but on average you would need to hit him over six times to beat him. Even if you maxed your damage rolls that is still over 4 hits to take him down.
That is some lucky dice rolling and bad dice rolling on the DM.
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Wrathamon
Adventurer
Just to see if my character would have won.
lvl 2 AC 19 +5 1d8+5 Heavy Armor Master for the DR and I have 20 hp
I won 1 out of 5 if I didn't have my clerics buffing me. It was almost 2 out of 5, I got the 1/2 dragon to 1.
with Bless on me I won 3 out of 5
with Shield of Faith I won 2 out of 5
When I lost it was failing of the breath.
I did notice that the dice roller was rolling very high for me and not very high for the cyan. But, he did crit (I never did). I dont always trust online dice rollers. I dont think I would have gotten that lucky with the spells but it was a noticeable difference.
If I did that in the event, or was DMing I would think the clerics would need to be deceptive and mask their concentration or else that might not be honorable, otherwise I think I would have lost like everyone else. The breath weapon is the breaker.
But, is he not beatable? I think he actually is beatable by a 2nd level character with good AC and makes his Ref save, if fate is on their side.
lvl 2 AC 19 +5 1d8+5 Heavy Armor Master for the DR and I have 20 hp
I won 1 out of 5 if I didn't have my clerics buffing me. It was almost 2 out of 5, I got the 1/2 dragon to 1.
with Bless on me I won 3 out of 5
with Shield of Faith I won 2 out of 5
When I lost it was failing of the breath.
I did notice that the dice roller was rolling very high for me and not very high for the cyan. But, he did crit (I never did). I dont always trust online dice rollers. I dont think I would have gotten that lucky with the spells but it was a noticeable difference.
If I did that in the event, or was DMing I would think the clerics would need to be deceptive and mask their concentration or else that might not be honorable, otherwise I think I would have lost like everyone else. The breath weapon is the breaker.
But, is he not beatable? I think he actually is beatable by a 2nd level character with good AC and makes his Ref save, if fate is on their side.
Zaruthustran
The tingling means it’s working!
Our barbarian accepted the challenge. But lost initiative, and was chopped down in the first round (crit, then regular hit).
If he could have raged, that would have helped. But that's why the init roll is so important.
The rest of the party rushed out and healed him. And the defeat made the second encounter that much sweeter.
Good encounter.
PS to shamsael: The Dueling style has two requirements: "wielding a melee weapon in one hand" (that's your rapier), and "no other weapons" (a shield is not a weapon). So yes, you get the +2 damage. No group insistence required.
If he could have raged, that would have helped. But that's why the init roll is so important.
The rest of the party rushed out and healed him. And the defeat made the second encounter that much sweeter.
Good encounter.
PS to shamsael: The Dueling style has two requirements: "wielding a melee weapon in one hand" (that's your rapier), and "no other weapons" (a shield is not a weapon). So yes, you get the +2 damage. No group insistence required.
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