Kisanji Arael
First Post
Herein lies my inherent problem with EXP components for item creation. In everything that we, as FRP gamers do, I believe we should consider, to some degree or another, two elements: the story and the game. EXP is balanced in terms of the game. It ensures that people must expend energy to gain energy. Nothing lost, nothing gained, as the old adage goes. However, consider the story.
The smith looked down at his forge, the molten steel cooling below him. As he looked down at the blade, he could tell that it had been filled with his very soul, that he had perhaps lost something to it. He knew for a fact that he would never create a blade of such power again.
[Here lies the first of the unrealistic measures, though taken to an extreme, of item creation bound to EXP components. A weapon smith who would create a blade so powerful that he would, in fact, set down his hammer because there would be no point in continuing. From a realistic standpoint, impossible. However, from a storytelling aspect, perfectly acceptable. But if we continue the exercise further, it becomes ever more unrealistic.]
Despite the fact that he had spent the last 10 years creating a weapon using mostly upper-body strength, the blacksmith was, in fact, weaker physically than he had began. He had become less talented at everything he had once known how to do, not only including blacksmithing itself, but also in his abilities to speak with others (diplomacy), appraise the value of items, and concentrate for long periods of time on any one thing. He could no longer survive in any tavern brawl, and though he had once single-handedly slain a dragon, he was now unable to handle a small band of kobolds.
[End ridiculous story] Important note, which Green Slime points out late in this topic. Casters cannot lose levels, stats, etc due to item creation. This is my fault; this first paragraph is pure hyperbole based on the concept of experience loss. I'm only leaving it here because I'm not going to brush it under the carpet like it never existed. But yes, it was a mistake.
My question, then, is what other approaches people have taken to remove this aspect of the game without hurting game balance.
1. A system in which every level one gains gives a certain amount of crafting points to be spent. However, this gives power to classes more likely to pick up item creation feats without giving them any discernible weaknesses.
2. Significantly reducing the amount of exp cost, but assigning a point cost to all magic items and putting a limit on the number of magic items that one can wear. The pros of this system are that it accurately explains why the elves at Rivendell didn't trick out Frodo, because (wearing not only the one ring of power, but also Sting and the mithril suit, he had already hit his cap. The downside is deciding whether certain classes are more capable of this than others, and balancing the limit against various level caps. At some point in the higher levels, one would either have to stop the progression entirely (barring feats), or the limit would become so high that it would no longer be a restriction. This last scenario is perhaps more troubling than it seems, since a large amount of item creation will most likely be performed at higher levels.
3. Allowing EXP or crafting points to be supplemented by, or require all together, rare components which enables the process. Pros: balanced by gameplay, interesting story possibilities. Cons: presents a situation where a DM may have to put his story on hold for side quests (finding starmetal, anyone?), integrate them into the story (which leads to the question of “who gets the next item buff”), or simply not make creation possible at all, due to a pure lack of resources and the necessity to finish the story.
The only option which seems to consistently work is one where a DM disallows items creation all together, works with his players' needs, and presents items that will fill those needs. This can be enhanced by games where the party is split up, because it can allow for the items to find the characters, not the other way around. This only works, however, with strong communicative skills outside of the normal gaming session, and player agreement that any items found will go to the player for whom they were created. While it seems by far the best option, it removes an option from the players completely, which is something that I, as a DM, have always found to backfire on me in the end.
Any thoughts or suggestions? Have you found a better method and/or built a better mousetrap? I would love to hear about anything that you all have done.
The smith looked down at his forge, the molten steel cooling below him. As he looked down at the blade, he could tell that it had been filled with his very soul, that he had perhaps lost something to it. He knew for a fact that he would never create a blade of such power again.
[Here lies the first of the unrealistic measures, though taken to an extreme, of item creation bound to EXP components. A weapon smith who would create a blade so powerful that he would, in fact, set down his hammer because there would be no point in continuing. From a realistic standpoint, impossible. However, from a storytelling aspect, perfectly acceptable. But if we continue the exercise further, it becomes ever more unrealistic.]
Despite the fact that he had spent the last 10 years creating a weapon using mostly upper-body strength, the blacksmith was, in fact, weaker physically than he had began. He had become less talented at everything he had once known how to do, not only including blacksmithing itself, but also in his abilities to speak with others (diplomacy), appraise the value of items, and concentrate for long periods of time on any one thing. He could no longer survive in any tavern brawl, and though he had once single-handedly slain a dragon, he was now unable to handle a small band of kobolds.
[End ridiculous story] Important note, which Green Slime points out late in this topic. Casters cannot lose levels, stats, etc due to item creation. This is my fault; this first paragraph is pure hyperbole based on the concept of experience loss. I'm only leaving it here because I'm not going to brush it under the carpet like it never existed. But yes, it was a mistake.
My question, then, is what other approaches people have taken to remove this aspect of the game without hurting game balance.
1. A system in which every level one gains gives a certain amount of crafting points to be spent. However, this gives power to classes more likely to pick up item creation feats without giving them any discernible weaknesses.
2. Significantly reducing the amount of exp cost, but assigning a point cost to all magic items and putting a limit on the number of magic items that one can wear. The pros of this system are that it accurately explains why the elves at Rivendell didn't trick out Frodo, because (wearing not only the one ring of power, but also Sting and the mithril suit, he had already hit his cap. The downside is deciding whether certain classes are more capable of this than others, and balancing the limit against various level caps. At some point in the higher levels, one would either have to stop the progression entirely (barring feats), or the limit would become so high that it would no longer be a restriction. This last scenario is perhaps more troubling than it seems, since a large amount of item creation will most likely be performed at higher levels.
3. Allowing EXP or crafting points to be supplemented by, or require all together, rare components which enables the process. Pros: balanced by gameplay, interesting story possibilities. Cons: presents a situation where a DM may have to put his story on hold for side quests (finding starmetal, anyone?), integrate them into the story (which leads to the question of “who gets the next item buff”), or simply not make creation possible at all, due to a pure lack of resources and the necessity to finish the story.
The only option which seems to consistently work is one where a DM disallows items creation all together, works with his players' needs, and presents items that will fill those needs. This can be enhanced by games where the party is split up, because it can allow for the items to find the characters, not the other way around. This only works, however, with strong communicative skills outside of the normal gaming session, and player agreement that any items found will go to the player for whom they were created. While it seems by far the best option, it removes an option from the players completely, which is something that I, as a DM, have always found to backfire on me in the end.
Any thoughts or suggestions? Have you found a better method and/or built a better mousetrap? I would love to hear about anything that you all have done.
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