D&D (2024) I like the new Warlock

[Mistwell]

Having already watched it it's exactly what I'd expect from Treeantmonk; superficial and not looking at the package as a whole, just checking the parts. If you feed the Artificer into that analysis it comes out looking good because all the parts of it look pretty decent while ignoring the lack of synergies and ability to do better than the baseline. Good spell list, decent base abilities, some other stuff (items not invocations) all looked at piecewise rather than as a whole.

I mean, it's the opposite of that. He absolutely looks at it as the whole. And this has nothing to do with the Artificer.

 

[Parmandur]

I'm sure hexblade will be the fourth "patron" in the PHB and since its signature ability (using Cha for pact weapons) is now part of blade pact, they will update it to be the true "gish" build.

Actually, I think the changes to the Pact may have obviate the Hexblade. The UA flavor writeup mentions Fiends, Hags, Archfey, Far Realms things, and Celestials. I'm betting Celestial for the fourth option.

 

[Mirrorrorrim]

Actually, I think the changes to the Pact may have obviate the Hexblade. The UA flavor writeup mentions Fiends, Hags, Archery, Far Realms things, and Celestials. I'm betting Celestial.

I agree about Celestial, as it is thematically the best justification as to why there are Wisdom Warlocks.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Celestial also works in terms of creating a balanced presentation. Warlocks still have a rep of being all "I sold my soul to the devil" so having Celestial in the PHB helps balance out that perception in a way that Fey and GOO never seemed to be able to do.

 

[ArwensDaughter]

Sorry accidental post. Can’t delete on app.

 

[THEMNGMNT]

Yeah, I feel like Pact of the Blade just ate Hexblade's lunch. Also, I never liked that at 6th level the Hexblade became a pet class. Bizarre design decision (which was made with multiple subclasses in that book). That said, I think this new Warlock creates a design space for having your patron be a "real world" but fantastical organization rather than an otherworldly entity. Like, a conclave of dragons, or a wizard king, or an ancient order of mystics.

 

[Veltharis ap Rylix]

I think there's still room for a Hexblade patron, at least conceptually...

The biggest problem with the Hexblade as presently designed is that it was always a patch job for the '14 PHB Blade Pact first and foremost, so with them fixing Blade Pact for the '24 PHB, it seems like significant chunks of the Hexblade's core kit are being rendered obsolete.

But I think "hexes, curses, and dark Shadowfell magic" is still an angle that can serve quite well as a foundation, and more importantly, one that could likely be retooled to serve all Pacts equally well, rather than essentially forcing the choice of Blade Pact by default.

Maybe give the Hexblade a new name if the "blade" part is now more explicitly optional, but I think it can still work.

That said, I think this new Warlock creates a design space for having your patron be a "real world" but fantastical organization rather than an otherworldly entity. Like, a conclave of dragons, or a wizard king, or an ancient order of mystics.

Keith Baker has floated the idea of using the Trust of Zilargo as a Warlock Patron option in Eberron, basically playing a Warlock as a gnomish James Bond-style secret agent with a whole bunch of magical gadgets serving as the vehicle for their powers.

 

[Chaosmancer]

I think there's still room for a Hexblade patron, at least conceptually...

The biggest problem with the Hexblade as presently designed is that it was always a patch job for the '14 PHB Blade Pact first and foremost, so with them fixing Blade Pact for the '24 PHB, it seems like significant chunks of the Hexblade's core kit are being rendered obsolete.

But I think the "hexes, curses, and dark Shadowfell magic" angle is still one that can serve quite well as a foundation, and more importantly, one that could likely be retooled to serve all Pacts equally well, rather than essentially forcing the choice of Blade Pact by default.

Maybe give the Hexblade a new name if the "blade" part is now more explicitly optional, but I think it can still work.

Yeah, when I remade my warlocks I took the "blade" out and made them the "Pact of the Cursed Ones" focusing on curses and shadow magic, while making deals with dark entities from the Shadowfell.

The concept of making a deal with "The Dark" is strong, and can be even stronger without the focus on weapon use.

 

[Neonchameleon]

I mean, it's the opposite of that. He absolutely looks at it as the whole. And this has nothing to do with the Artificer.

I mean he literally doesn't look at what it does from round to round and see where the big gap in it is which is the reason only high level casting worked. He looks at the parts and how they appear.

 

[Mistwell]

I mean he literally doesn't look at what it does from round to round and see where the big gap in it is which is the reason only high level casting worked. He looks at the parts and how they appear.

He does see it and talk about it. I think you've lost some objectivity on this topic. ANYONE who says they like the Warlock changes you go off on at this point.