If PCs are 1st level, why don't their 9th level patrons help?

[Will]

Another thing to keep in mind is that in most situations, there are something on the order of eight times as many first level guys as 9th level guys.

This goes toward the number of problems... if you have 30 kobold 'problems' and 3 demon incursions, what would you do with 8 1st level parties and 1 9th level party?

In my campaign, the PCs are relatively high level, but there are significantly higher level still. The PCs aren't charged with tasks, typically... they were free agents for a time. They took care of things because they were near the top in the backwater region they lived in.

They hit very powerful threats... and since they were first on the scene, well, there you go.

Still, there's plenty of reason to believe a high level character might be busy.

Another possibility is visibility. A 9th level guy waltzing around, searching for the lost knob of Knobbiness will draw attention. A group of 1st level adventurers? Ha.

From a 9th level guy's perspective, sending 1st level parties on the off chance they might succeed in a way the 9th level guy would not is worth the risk... of someone else...

 

[Atridis]

I've thought about this over the years, too, and I've found two ways to approach it:

1: Many of the leaders and decision-makers of the world are NOT "9th level." Is the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs better at engaging the enemy than a Master Chief in the Navy SEALs? Who's really "9th level"? One of my characters was a formerly-successful warrior, coming out of retirement. The premise of the character was that he had gotten old and soft and had actually lost "levels", and was back to being "first level."

2: There's nothing wrong with having the 9th-level guys come out and smoke a warband of orcs once in awhile. Most players hate any sense of "deus ex machina", but you can integrate the high-level and low-level characters. For instance, the Evil Dragon attacks the famous Powerful NPC while his minions raid a nearby village. Whether or not the dragon is defeated isn't the point, the village is the key.

Also, high-level NPCs can be a resource for the PCs, albeit one with a price. I've run an adventure in which the 2nd-level PCs had to make a mad dash across town to alert the Powerful Clerics to the demon that they had accidentally released. The Powerful Clerics were a safety net, but they were suitably annoyed with the PCs for letting the demon out, and they confiscated all of the treasure that the PCs had taken from the Evil Temple. As far as the game-play went, a "combat" in which the PCs were simply trying to distract, delay, and survive an enemy they couldn't possibly defeat was pretty exciting.

 

[Ariddrake]

You could just adjust the level of the person who assigns the task. Where it is not that big of a level gap.

4th level Mayor asks 1st lvl group to look into event

9th lvl Cleric asks 6th lvl group to check out abandoned temple

15th lvl King asks 12 lvl group to tackle planar invasion

Just an opinion

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

[/b]
And why are generals supposed to be better combat troops than their subordinates? It depends on the military force in question. In many more primitve organizations, leadership went to those who could prove their prowess in combat, regardless of their other qualifications.

This is simply nonsense, and certainly would not apply in a theoretically feudal society. It isn't even true of most bad fantasy novels.

[/b]
In other systems, leadership was determined by social rank. And so on.

This I agree with, but this argues against the level based system.

 

[jester47]

There are two roots to the problem everyone is missing.

1) Power level should never be an indicator of position in society. Making it so is the root of the problem. Positions of power in society are doled out in many different ways, from legit recognition of a person's responsibility to bribes, to political reasons, to a buddy system to some conspiracy.

2) The plot is too simple. There should never be just one problem. Think about our own world. There is not just one problem. Look at your own local politics and issues for examples.

So my advice- don't have just one problem, and don't make the cleric 9th level.

Also, people tend to loose sight of the way levels are supposed to work. They are a tool for the DM to use in adjusting the level of challenge for players. Period. Thats it.

And another thing- I have found that it really helps versimilitude if the PCs and the NPCs stats are all generated randomly. Random chance in character generation really does a lot for in D&D. His wis cha and hitpoints could be on the low side for a cleric.

So a clerics duties to a perish not withstanding, I think the issue is more in how you might be playing the game than in the mechanics.

Aaron.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

And sometimes the 9th level cleric doesn't want to change the status quo.

Example: Kobold raiders shake down the town leaders to not raid this year.

The 9th level cleric pays.

Kobolds don't raid.

Repeat for 3 or 4 years.

Party comes into town, acting like cowboys - attack the kobolds.

The kobolds raid.

Townsfolk die.

Guess who the 9th level cleric will be more upset with: The Party or the Kobolds?

The Auld Grump, in my homebrew game the head of the largest faith is a 3rd level expert... a bureaucrat not a miracle worker.

 

[Endur]

The disparity is almost as large in most skill-based systems. The best swordsman in the world will beat the 2nd best swordsman at least 9 out of 10 times in most skill based systems. On the other hand, the best swordsman might not be able to defeat twenty orcs in the typical skill based system whereas 20 orcs can be beaten in D&D.

 

[Nightfall]

Maybe they just don't FEEL like adventuring any more.

 

[silentspace]

Good question, and very interesting responses. I agree this is a problem you see often in adventures. The tremendous scaling in power as you go up in level does cause a lot of problems. Here's how I think about it.

Ninth level patrons don't deal with first level PCs. (There might be overriding reasons, but generally they don't.) In fact, the high-level patrons may not even be aware of the threat that the first level PCs are dealing with. It's simply below their radar. Seriously, what are the first level PCs dealing with? A few orcs? So you're a first level warrior patrolling the wilderness, and you see a few orcs. What do you do? Well, in this town the town guard doesn't like to risk its own troops in battle unless absolutely necessary. SOP is to hire adventurers. So, do you go back tell the ninth level big boss that you saw a few orcs? No! You tell your immediate superior, let's say a 2nd level sergeant. If he thinks he can requisition the funds to hire a few adventurers to handle it, he will. If not, maybe he'll tell his 4th level lieutenant, who has contacts with tougher adventurers, etc.

Edit spelling

 

[Droogie]

As already mentioned by Henry and others, high level (more "experienced" people) have more obligations and responsibilities. People of power don't do everything themselves. They delegate. As Henry said, a tribe of kobolds is no challenge for our 9th level cleric. He has more important things to worry about- things more appropriate for a 9th level leader. What better way to train future replacements by giving them some experience in the field with something they can handle?

The boss is perfectly capable of filing his own paperwork, but he doesn't. He shouldn't have to. He's got bigger fish to fry