D&D 5E If you use thunderstep but teleport less than 10 feet do you take damage?

[plisnithus8]

I'd rule that the PC was in the Feywild(?) for much less time than the duration of the breath attack, so no by me.

That was actually my point:
It seems unreasonable to let Misty Step teleport bypass damage in that manner so Thunderstep into damage range shouldn’t either.

A spell doesn’t take you to another plane unless the spell says it does.

A couple of questions:
1. Is there any evidence in 5e that teleporting sends you to another plane between the irihinating location and the end teleportation location?
2. What is the 5e language for something that happens faster than “instantly”?

 

[billd91]

That was actually my point:
It seems unreasonable to let Misty Step teleport bypass damage in that manner so Thunderstep into damage range shouldn’t either.

It's not necessarily the same thing, though. In one case, it's a readied character trying to react to their enemy's behavior and debating whether or not that readiness enables that character to preempt the enemy. In the other, it's a question of whether or not a caster can be hit by their own spell because we're debating instantaneous transportation vs something defined as happening immediately after disappearing.

The nits being picked are different and have different implications.

 

[tomBitonti]

I think there is a language / terminology issue here which is causing problems.

On the one hand, travel that begins in a location and that reaches a different location generally is required to have transited along some continuous path between the two locations. That's how everyday motion works, and the requirement is built into everyday language.

On the other hand, one can imagine simply disappearing from one location then reappearing at a second, distinct location.

In this second case, there are alternate ideas of how that might happen. For example, Trek transporters, as originally described, convert matter into energy, send the energy through space, then convert the energy back into matter at the destination. Aside from the difficulty of doing the conversions, this turns into everyday travel, just with energy doing the moving instead of matter. The energy still follows a continuous path between locations.

But, one can envision the disappearance and appearance happening without following a continuous path between the locations.

This second case runs into the language problem. Using "movement" or "travel" to describe the event pulls in the understood requirement of continuous motion. Saying "We used teleportation to travel from the dungeon to our safe house" gets into trouble because of the usual meaning of "travel".

What is the appropriate terminology for discontinuous motion?

This all could lead to a terribly irritating conversation:

"So you traveled from the dungeon to the safe house?"

No.

But you left the dungeon?

Yes.

And you arrived at your safe house, after leaving the dungeon?

Again, yes.

But your contend that you did not travel to your save house?

That is correct. I did not.

TomB

 

[James Gasik]

As I said before though, this is such a strange corner case to worry about. The spell isn't even that good, I don't see why it's a problem in the first place. It feels like there's this mindset where some people believe magic use should be risky and casters should always have a chance to explode for using their class abilities.

It's like that three or four months I used the critical hit and fumble tables out of Best of Dragon vol. 4. It was fun for awhile, then it just got weird, and finally it was tedious and lame.

 

[plisnithus8]

As I said before though, this is such a strange corner case to worry about. The spell isn't even that good, I don't see why it's a problem in the first place. It feels like there's this mindset where some people believe magic use should be risky and casters should always have a chance to explode for using their class abilities.

Or it's as simple as someone lighting a stick of dynamite and then not moving far enough away before it exploded, only there is magic involved.
And in a broader sense gets at what happens during a teleport: is someone moving to fomenter-planar space and then back again or are they folding space. The former could take time, the latter not so much.

I think there is a language / terminology issue here which is causing problems.

On the one hand, travel that begins in a location and that reaches a different location generally is required to have transited along some continuous path between the two locations. That's how everyday motion works, and the requirement is built into everyday language.

On the other hand, one can imagine simply disappearing from one location then reappearing at a second, distinct location.

In this second case, there are alternate ideas of how that might happen. For example, Trek transporters, as originally described, convert matter into energy, send the energy through space, then convert the energy back into matter at the destination. Aside from the difficulty of doing the conversions, this turns into everyday travel, just with energy doing the moving instead of matter. The energy still follows a continuous path between locations.

But, one can envision the disappearance and appearance happening without following a continuous path between the locations.

Travel:
1. go from one place to another, typically over a distance of some length.
"the vessel had been traveling from Libya to Ireland"
2. (of an object or radiation) move, typically in a constant or predictable way.
"light travels faster than sound"

For teleportation, I'd have to say that traveling referee to the first definition since it is not a typical mode of travel.

The Teleport spell uses the words "instantly transports you." There is no mention of transforming you into energy. As JC would say, a spell only does what it says it does. If a DM wanted to say the spell also polymorphs a creature into energy, moves the creature, has them change planes and return, or any other home-brew idea, they absolutely can do that, but that is not RAW.

 

[tomBitonti]

Or it's as simple as someone lighting a stick of dynamite and then not moving far enough away before it exploded, only there is magic involved.
And in a broader sense gets at what happens during a teleport: is someone moving to fomenter-planar space and then back again or are they folding space. The former could take time, the latter not so much.


Travel:
1. go from one place to another, typically over a distance of some length.
"the vessel had been traveling from Libya to Ireland"
2. (of an object or radiation) move, typically in a constant or predictable way.
"light travels faster than sound"

For teleportation, I'd have to say that traveling referee to the first definition since it is not a typical mode of travel.

The Teleport spell uses the words "instantly transports you." There is no mention of transforming you into energy. As JC would say, a spell only does what it says it does. If a DM wanted to say the spell also polymorphs a creature into energy, moves the creature, has them change planes and return, or any other home-brew idea, they absolutely can do that, but that is not RAW.

But but but, in the phrase "instantly transports you", does that mean "transports you continuously along a path"? Conversion into energy and cross to alternate dimensions seem precluded. But is "continuous motion" necessarily included? Is that meaning to be used for understanding "teleportation", or is it unwanted, accidental, baggage which should be discarded?

TomB

 

[Vaalingrade]

W...why does that tweet end with 'Bigger D*ck Mike' at the bottom?

New audio equipment for the VTT?

 

[plisnithus8]

I don't understand how it could mean "transports you continuously along a path"? Teleportation does not use Speed. It ignores barriers and dangers that lie between the start and end points.
Teleportation typically means "instantaneous travel between two locations without crossing the intervening space" so not continuous movement. I'm not sure why the idea of continuous motion in relationship to teleportation is coming from.

 

[plisnithus8]

W...why does that tweet end with 'Bigger D*ck Mike' at the bottom?

New audio equipment for the VTT?

LOL, I don't know why that was on the screenshot. I went back to find it and only came up with this:

 

[tomBitonti]

I don't understand how it could mean "transports you continuously along a path"? Teleportation does not use Speed. It ignores barriers and dangers that lie between the start and end points.
Teleportation typically means "instantaneous travel between two locations without crossing the intervening space" so not continuous movement. I'm not sure why the idea of continuous motion in relationship to teleportation is coming from.

This was to address an earlier discussion in the thread. There was an argument that teleport required movement of some sort between the points. That is, continuous motion along a path. For example, a dip into the ether, or into the astral or shadow planes. Various forms of teleport spells have required such paths in different editions.

TomB