Is 4th edition getting soft? - edited for friendly content :)

[Desdichado]

Second, I wasn't too thrilled with the connotations the thread started out with, but Hobo convinced me with his post to let this stay open. I'll be brief; anyone who attempts to push this back into politics or makes snide political comments will get me swinging the banhammer post-haste.

W00t! Do I win the "special snowflake of the thread" award for being decidely non-politic?

 

[Arashi Ravenblade]

Save or Die needs to stay. Players often forget that D&D is a game where the players pretty much can do the same things to the bad guys. He Finger of deaths you? Finger him back!

I have thought that 4e is shaping up to be the creampuff edition. And I liked the extreme nature of 3e.

 

[Hjorimir]

I'd be fine with WotC removing save-or-die spells/effects; then again, I'd be fine with the removal of raise dead spells.

 

[Grog]

Save or Die needs to stay. Players often forget that D&D is a game where the players pretty much can do the same things to the bad guys. He Finger of deaths you? Finger him back!

Which is also a problem. Taking out the BBEG on the first round of combat with a save-or-die isn't much fun for anyone, either.

"Gee, that was the climactic battle of the whole campaign, we'd been building up to it for months, and it was over in one round. Um.... Yay?"

 

[Scribble]

They are kind of annoying. Even as a player a few games ago, I felt really cheap using a save or die on one of the "big fight" monsters... Just felt like cheating.

Also get rid of easy to cast raise dead spells.

 

[Tewligan]

He Finger of deaths you? Finger him back!

I think the Book of Erotic Fantasy had rules for your suggested response.

 

[howandwhy99]

Easy =/= Oversimplification.
3e was not easy for me.

I don't think it has to do so much with ease of play as indistinguishable mechanics. Rolling 1d20+mod for everything ever means the game feels monotone.

Real life is in color. It needs a variety of mechanics to satisfactorily simulate and stimulate. I'd actually much prefer if they added dice pools, card pulls, betting chips, and whatever else they felt worked in addition to the d20 mechanic, instead of oversimplifying even more.

Maybe it's an inability to see outside the 3e box? I don't know, but I do agree with the blandness of the mechanics - as if thoroughly de-prioritized "fluff"/description will make the game engaging after the fact.

 

[Remathilis]

Save or Die needs to stay. Players often forget that D&D is a game where the players pretty much can do the same things to the bad guys. He Finger of deaths you? Finger him back!

Kinda hard when you're already dead...

 

[Clavis]

Baby Samurai
- alternate lifestyle druids, please.

Wouldn't that mean that they HATE nature?

I guess you've never actually seen what what animals of the same gender will do with each other if given the chance...
Sorta destroys the whole contrary-to-nature argument.

 

[Flynn]

And I can't recall the last book or movie I saw where the badguy just makes one of the heroes drop dead.

In "The Matrix", Cypher unplugs Switch and Apoc on the ship, and they just drop dead, both in and out of the matrix. Does that count?

Okay, I'll get back on topic...

With Regards,
Flynn