Is D&D 4E too "far out" to expand the market easily?

[Ruin Explorer]

And, to be honest, I am not convinced that WotC should try to fight that trend. Current players probably do a better job of selling the game and making it fun for new people than any WotC marketing could.

The problem with this attitude is that it seems to be intentionally ignoring the fact that, at some point, people were picking up D&D and getting into it without being taught by others. Largely in the 1980s, it seems. It seems like with was down to boxed-set-type D&D, too.

It's good for WotC to support their players in reaching new players (hey, even I do it), but unless they genuinely try to reach some people who've not played before, well, I don't think that the rate of new player induction will outstrip player loss, put it like that.

 

[The Highway Man]

I can counter that argument with a single children's cartoon: Disney's Gargoyles.
All the main protagonists were monsterous humanoids with wings and claws. The series also had adventures in the feywild and dealings with fey that we would call Eladrin. A great deal of the Gargoyle's story borrowed heavilly from the works of Shakespear

I don't think you get what I was trying to say. "Dragonborn", the meme, the word-idea, is not rooted in collective memory, if you will. "Dragon" and "Dungeon" are. When you say "dragon" to anybody, anyone will be able to see their "own" version of what a dragon is. When you say "dragonborn", it's not as clear an idea - most people will ask "what the heck is that?" That's what's more and more wrong with the D&D setting, IMO.

Nevermind the conceptual origins, inspirations and so on. These cannot be known without reading the actual book and getting into the implied "Star Wars" D&D setting referred to earlier.

 

[Corjay]

for a group of people that pretend to be pretty elven princesses, gamers are a surprisingly snobby bunch.

rofl. QFT.

I don't think you get what I was trying to say. "Dragonborn", the meme, the word-idea, is not rooted in collective memory, if you will. "Dragon" and "Dungeon" are. When you say "dragon" to anybody, anyone will be able to see their "own" version of what a dragon is. When you say "dragonborn", it's not as clear an idea - most people will ask "what the heck is that?" That's what's more and more wrong with the D&D setting, IMO.

I don't know whether to laugh my head off at this pseudo-intellectual "meme" talk, or to hang my head in disappointment at the human race.

 

[The Highway Man]

I don't know whether to laugh my head off at this pseudo-intellectual "meme" talk, or to hang my head in disappointment at the human race.

Well, if you want to start snipping and belittling people instead of formulating arguments to have an actual conversation, that's your problem. Have fun on top of your ivory tower.

 

[Umbran]

The problem with this attitude is that it seems to be intentionally ignoring the fact that, at some point, people were picking up D&D and getting into it without being taught by others. Largely in the 1980s, it seems. It seems like with was down to boxed-set-type D&D, too.

We should not equate "there was a massive increase in sales" to "there was a massive increase in people learning it from the books by themselves". All the increase shows was an increase in the player base. It does not speak directly to how they were learning.

One DM, setting up a new group, can teach a whole bunch of folks. Do that twice (once in high school, once in college, say), and you have a massive increase in the player base.

You don't need the internet for viral marketing to be effective.

 

[Mallus]

I don't know whether to laugh my head off at this pseudo-intellectual "meme" talk...

Please remember to use the word 'meme' responsibly this 4th of July holiday...

Anyhow... this just occurred to me. Is 4e too 'out there'? How popular is the Metal Gear franchise again? Revolver Ocelot? Otacon? Solid/Liquid/Semi-solid/Plasma Snake?

If that baffling array of (preachy politicized, even) nerdery can enjoy 20 years worth mass market success, there is nothing inherently too 'out there' about D&4 4e.

 

[Corjay]

Well, if you want to start snipping and belittling people instead of formulating arguments to have an actual conversation, that's your problem. Have fun on top of your ivory tower.

Yeah, I'm definitely going to pass on "formulating arguments" on meme-talk, thanks.

 

[Umbran]

I don't know whether to laugh my head off at this pseudo-intellectual "meme" talk, or to hang my head in disappointment at the human race.

Given The Rules of these boards, you want to do neither. You want to be civil and respectful to your fellow posters.

You're new, Corjay, so I suggest you go and review those rules.

 

[Corjay]

Thank you. I forget myself sometimes.

 

[hexgrid]

I don't think you get what I was trying to say. "Dragonborn", the meme, the word-idea, is not rooted in collective memory, if you will. "Dragon" and "Dungeon" are. When you say "dragon" to anybody, anyone will be able to see their "own" version of what a dragon is. When you say "dragonborn", it's not as clear an idea - most people will ask "what the heck is that?" That's what's more and more wrong with the D&D setting, IMO.

Nevermind the conceptual origins, inspirations and so on. These cannot be known without reading the actual book and getting into the implied "Star Wars" D&D setting referred to earlier.

Why is any of this a problem?