Is it inherently harder to be a female DM?

[Celebrim]

D&D has always been a pastime associated (not without some reason) with geekiness. There was a whole wave of young female casual gamers that White Wolf games brought in large part I think because the game was enherently 'sexy' and didn't make them feel like they were doing something geek. Perhaps that opinion is itself a bit sexist on my part, but that is how it seems (and in my defence, men aren't the only people that accept the norms of a sexist culture). As good as that has been for gaming, most of those aren't what I think of as 'gamers', because that's the only game they play. Alot of them leave the scene as quickly as they join it.

Still I've known quite a few very good female gamers. Some of them were brought in by WW. Alot of them were brought in by boyfriends. Not all of them stayed with the game, but those that did were usually very good. As a DM who appreciates characterization, it's been my experience that female players are on the whole alot more interested in the social side of gaming, and alot less interested in merely power gaming to stroke thier egos.

I've known very few gamers that are as big of jerks as those you describe. If they won't grow up (and if they are really 20+ it is likely that they won't), find a new group. Heck, find a new social scene. Does this sort of behavior only occur around the table, or are these guys pretty immature in general? If you are at college, it should be pretty easy to talk around and find out who is involved in what games. Gamers are after all a pretty small social scene. It is almost impossible for me to imagine any gaming group out there that won't make room at the table for an experienced female gamer, so just introduce yourself to as many as you can find and take your pick.

On the other hand, I know from experience that just openly advertising that you are a DM looking for a group of player basically only attracts the losers that have been kicked out of everyone else's groups. As a fellow DM, I sympathize with the difficulty in getting a campaign started. It is alot harder to find a group of good players that aren't already attached to a DM, than it is to find a DM willing to have another player at the table.

If you can't or don't want to leave this group, lay down the law lady.

You are the DM, this is your game, keep them focused on the game. You are in charge. This is your show. Get good at staring. Even if you were a male, alot of gamers will run over you if you let them (I speak from experience there). Actually, count forcefulness training as one of the things you can learn from playing D&D, if you are self-confessed not forceful enough consider this career training (for whatever career you plan on entering). If they won't stay IC, find a way to make them stay IC (I really like PirateCat's idea). Tell them any OOC comment that they make may be treated as an IC comment. Don't let their minds wander. If they start being excessively OOC in a combat situation, charge them thier free IC actions (you spent all your extra time talking, you don't have time for more comments). If they are delaying, starting counting down from 6 to 1 and if they don't do something IC by 1, then they don't do anything IC that round. If they are talking too much, move right a long and start having things happening. Make them realize that they have to pay attention to you if they won't to know what is going on. If they won't pay attention, then assume that their character is ICly not paying attention either (no search, spot, or listen checks - remember all comments are IC at your descrestion. And its hard to move silently while jabbering.) If they wander away from the table, spend more time telling jokes than not, engage in inappropriate wisecracks, then close your books, put them away and say 'You guys don't seem to have your minds on gaming tonight. Why don't we rent a movie or something?'. You have to make them understand that if they are here to game, then that is what they should be doing.

 

[randomling]

Everyone who's posted player control tips - thanks, I need them badly! I have some great players and one or two people who like to stretch my patience as far as it can go. In fairness, they like to stretch the patience of any DM they play with, but since I have a bit of difficulty telling them what to do they think they can get away with it.

I'm giving this thread a slight bump so that anyone who's in the US (and parts west) and posts late at night gets to see it. Going to bed now, but I wanted to leave a few comments first.

1) I'm not an experienced gamer. I've been playing almost exactly a year and I'm wondering if I started DMing too early. I'm not good with rules (especially since fighting isn't my favourite part of the game).

2) The university I go to is really "trendy" and quite small. There is no official roleplaying society - not even a science fiction society - and the chances of there being a countable number of gamers at college are pretty much non-existent. The trademark response to my idea of starting an RPing society is hysterical laughter.

3) Although I had some problem with jokes to start with, I really thought I had these guys tamed! Part of my annoyance is that it was an unpleasant surprise when it happened. My players are my friends and this kind of stuff isn't an issue on non-gaming social events.

Blah. Goodnight, ENWorld.

 

[DanMcS]

Once out of six sessions isn't a trend, and there are always off days. Can't really judge, because I don't know any of you, but if you thought you were past the "sexist jerk" crap, you probably were. So it was an off day.

It could mean, incidentally, that you're one of the guys now and they didn't even realize they were offending you. In that case, just ask them to tone it down so you can get some gaming done.

It could also be that you're a less than assertive DM, and they would have done it to anybody, male or female. That's a harder fix, because you'll probably find it harder to be more forceful. Smack them down now, or deal with it for a long time to come.

 

[Ziona]

Is this because I'm a newcomer to DMing? Are they testing me out?

Is it because they know I'm not very forceful? I find it quite hard to make my voice heard sometimes and that can make DMing a bit of a challenge.

Or is it because I'm a girl?

I'd be interested to hear about the experiences of other female DMs - and from male players too. Do guys accept female players and DMs in their group? Does this kind of thing happen in other people's games?

Help me?

I am a woman as well. All I can tell you is that each time I have brought up DMing to the group I play with, only one of the guys have ever been encouraging. Most of them have scoffed and laughed or been silent while the rest thought I was joking. It sucked, because at one point, I had done research and had made maps and such, and when they reacted like they did, I trashed it all. It really p*@$$ed me off! So, I have never brought it up again. On the rare occasion that it has come up, I just tell them I would never consider DMing again (at least not for them).

I don't understand this reaction, either. I love to write, and they have complimented me on my storytelling, so I thought I could DM. Apparently they did not think so. I don't know if it's because I'm a girl, or if they don't think I'm experienced enough. (I've been playing for about 7 1/2 years now...I first starting playing 2nd edition AD&D).

At any rate, it is a mystery to me why they will encourage others who are less experienced than myself to DM, but scoff and laugh at the thought of me DMing. (they have encouraged other males to DM who have been playing a year or so...) I don't see them as being sexist, so I don't understand why they think I would be so bad at DMing. They could have given me a chance at least.

So I see where you're coming from, and I'm sorry I can't offer more insight, except to say that I know how you feel. It's frustrating...at least you're actually DMing!!

 

[I'm A Banana]

Maybe my group's slightly more enlightened.

See, we play where the girls outnumber the guys 2-1. I (male) DM. A friend of mine (female) Co-DM's.

They give us pretty much the same respect, and I do it likewise to them. The one guy who doesn't DM is pretty cool with it too....

I don't think it's a universal at all...

I think perhaps you game with doofuses, and perhaps you just need to re-iterate that you're uncomfortable with it.

There's no spite behind it, methinks.

 

[ced1106]

They were "social" jokes, yeah - not directed at me - but of the type that guys seem to make when they're by themselves and don't tend to (in my experience) when women are around. It was like I wasn't even there.

The good news: They don't notice you're a woman, and treat you as one of them.

The bad news: They don't notice you're a woman, and treat you as one of them.

Personally, I don't think it's an issue of sex. You don't like to hear sexist jokes. I'm sure many males don't, either. Tell them that you'd appreciate them not to engage in XYZ behavior and thank them for it.

Also, speaking of male player behavior... (;
http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?threadid=23422&highlight=ab3


Cedric.
aka. Washu! ^O^

 

[DWARF]

Also, speaking of male player behavior... (;
http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?threadid=23422&highlight=ab3

Gut officially busted.

 

[Celtavian]

Re

Let them know it makes you feel uncomfortable, maybe they will stop.

Does this happen all the time or is this the first time? I don't quite understand why they were calling you wench. That seems more than a little rude unless they know you are comfortable with the term and they use it as a term of affection.

I have noticed that quite a few male gamers act very strange around females who are present at the gaming table. It doesn't even really matter whether or not they are playing.

 

[Darkness]

I think that - like many player-DM problems - it's a problem of communication.

Is this because I'm a newcomer to DMing? Are they testing me out?

Is it because they know I'm not very forceful? I find it quite hard to make my voice heard sometimes and that can make DMing a bit of a challenge.

Or is it because I'm a girl?

I'd say it's because you're a girl new to DMing an all-male group and can't make your voice heard sometimes.

See, DMing generally often isn't easy at first, many guys are prone to senseless (and, often enough, tasteless ) sillyness, and being unable to make oneself heard is a big problem for a DM.

I don't think (though I might be wrong, given that I don't know your group) that they are intentionally testing you out or ignoring you because you are not very forceful; rather, I think that they just get caught up in their antics and don't realize what problems they're causing.
Explaining (preferably before the game) that certain behavior makes it hard to concentrate on the game and thus is to be avoided, and/or being more forceful when they fall out of line, is key here, I think.

 

[Queen_of_Hearts]

First, you don't have it as bad as some (there's another post with attendance problems: http://enworld.cyberstreet.com/showthread.php?threadid=32134).

But let's face it, you've got a problem with your players. Now any roleplaying is a social experience, as is story telling and joke telling. Your players may be mixing up their socializing? Do you have any breaks during sessions, to "shoot the breeze" and grab a snack/smoke/etc? Maybe scheduled breaks could help?

But I would talk to your players and see if it's disinterest in what their doing or if it's just we're together and hanging out and jokes didn't seem to be a problem.