D&D General Joe Manganiello: Compares Early 5E to BG 3 . How Important is Lore?

[TheSword]

I think it's more how things are updated vs update or not.

I don't expect races for example to follow racial restrictions from back in the day.

But one shouldn't drop a Dwarven magocracy into Greyhawk either. Haven't seen a Dwarf wizard in 24 years anyway.

Of course.

I’m not sure there have been changes to FR lore in 5th that justify the idea that it’s a pale shadow.

The beef seems to be more that they haven’t covered enough not that what they have covered is bad. Which means the old stuff is still sitting there.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Of course.

I’m not sure there have been changes to FR lore in 5th that justify the idea that it’s a pale shadow.

The beef seems to be more that they haven’t covered enough not that what they have covered is bad. Which means the old stuff is still sitting there.

The Realms (or Eberron) were never my issue.

 

[Remathilis]

To me it matters how it's done. Does the new stuff interfere with the history, or the geography? Does its presence run contrary to the setting's themes? If not I don't see an issue with it.

That's unfortunately very subjective. For me, groups of roaming dragonborn nomads who travel across the Flaness don't ruin anything or feel out of place, considering Oerth is a kitchen sink world. For others, that's treason because they weren't specifically called out in the 1984 folio. Which is why strict constructionist readings of settings end up in dogma arguments. I don't consider adding a new race any more problematic than using some new monster in a supplement, but then again I have a very fluid concept of cannon.

 

[TheSword]

That's unfortunately very subjective. For me, groups of roaming dragonborn nomads who travel across the Flaness don't ruin anything or feel out of place, considering Oerth is a kitchen sink world. For others, that's treason because they weren't specifically called out in the 1984 folio. Which is why strict constructionist readings of settings end up in dogma arguments. I don't consider adding a new race any more problematic than using some new monster in a supplement, but then again I have a very fluid concept of cannon.

Yes I don’t see the issue of adding rather than replacing. Surely every new race is new at some point.

 

[Micah Sweet]

That's unfortunately very subjective. For me, groups of roaming dragonborn nomads who travel across the Flaness don't ruin anything or feel out of place, considering Oerth is a kitchen sink world. For others, that's treason because they weren't specifically called out in the 1984 folio. Which is why strict constructionist readings of settings end up in dogma arguments. I don't consider adding a new race any more problematic than using some new monster in a supplement, but then again I have a very fluid concept of cannon.

Where did the dragonborn come from? Should they have had an impact on historical events if they were there the whole time, or is there an in-universe explanation why they didn't? These are important questions to me.

 

[Zardnaar]

Adding everything new to Greyhawk all at once kinda ruins the setting imho. That's just FR light.

Races thst make sense fir the setting should take priority. Eg Genasi on Athas, Tieflings on Greyhawk.

I would still probably say yes to most things but the difference would be in what you meet. Play what you like but the major races are the AD&D ones and maybe tieflings near Iuz empire.

And the vibe would be a more dark ages 14th century pistach vs FR Renaissance Fair.

Otherwise it's just FR lite with silly names.

 

[TwoSix]

The issue of course is most people take silence as a pocket veto. For example, no version of Greyhawk has ever used the word "Dragonborn" in it, but that hasn't stopped grognards from screaming until they are hoarse that dragonborn should not exist on Oerth. Further, when the IS updated later to include new elements (3e Athas brought in psionic races like elan and dromite, 4e brought in tieflings and genasi) people again scream that it doesn't count because it wasn't done in 1994, it doesn't count.

Which is, quite frankly, bizarre. The original Greyhawk didn't have warlocks or sorcerers ever mentioned in it, because those classes didn't yet exist. Does that mean you can't make a new Greyhawk book with warlocks and sorcerers?

 

[TwoSix]

Adding everything new to Greyhawk all at once kinda ruins the setting imho. That's just FR light.

Races thst make sense fir the setting should take priority. Eg Genasi on Athas, Tieflings on Greyhawk.

I would still probably say yes to most things but the difference would be in what you meet. Play what you like but the major races are the AD&D ones and maybe tieflings near Iuz empire.

And the vibe would be a more dark ages 14th century pistach vs FR Renaissance Fair.

Otherwise it's just FR lite with silly names.

Yea, but then you're arguing that the definition of a setting isn't based purely on its own published material; rather, that part of its definition is in contrast to some other fiction.

I.e. Greyhawk isn't FR, so if Realms has X, Greyhawk must NOT have X.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Which is, quite frankly, bizarre. The original Greyhawk didn't have warlocks or sorcerers ever mentioned in it, because those classes didn't yet exist. Does that mean you can't make a new Greyhawk book with warlocks and sorcerers?

Of course not. In fact, I think both would fit into the grim sword & sorcery theme quite nicely.

 

[Remathilis]

Where did the dragonborn come from? Should they have had an impact on historical events if they were there the whole time, or is there an in-universe explanation why they didn't? These are important questions to me.

Migrated from other continent? Escaped from Deep underground? Maybe they were always just off-camera in remote locations and recently started interacting with humans who mistook them for lizard folk? Maybe Bahamut spawned them into existence? Maybe they were just humanoid race #672 like drow, orcs, gnolls, xvarts, goblins, tritons, and tabaxi who spent the majority of their time hanging out in wizard dungeons?