JollyDoc's Shackled City: FINAL POST [Updated 11/2!!]

[monboesen]

Great story but.....

Once again it seems as the characters are to powerfull for the adventure ?

They have trampled all over the last couples of fights. In fact the most difficulty has been from trapped doors !

Wasn't this supposed to be some sort of climatic last fight. And all it took was two of the companions to win that fight easily.

Hey DM, I say its time to step up the opposition or whip out the Disjunctions. I crave more close calls. Its strange because if my memory serves me they had plenty trouble in the last adventure (the one with the strange egg and dragon thingie).

Why has this changed. Better tactics, better equipment or something else ?

 

[R-Hero]

Great story but.....

Once again it seems as the characters are to powerfull for the adventure ?

Why has this changed. Better tactics, better equipment or something else ?

I believe this has been addressed before. The good doctor takes a certain liberty when writing the S.H. It takes away from the story re-writing every die roll.

Better tactics helped out but for the most it is in the die rolls. J.D. recieves as good as he gives combat-wise.

As far as power, wait till Ikon Daywalker makes an apperance.

 

[JollyDoc]

Great story but.....

Once again it seems as the characters are to powerfull for the adventure ?

They have trampled all over the last couples of fights. In fact the most difficulty has been from trapped doors !

Wasn't this supposed to be some sort of climatic last fight. And all it took was two of the companions to win that fight easily.

Hey DM, I say its time to step up the opposition or whip out the Disjunctions. I crave more close calls. Its strange because if my memory serves me they had plenty trouble in the last adventure (the one with the strange egg and dragon thingie).

Why has this changed. Better tactics, better equipment or something else ?

Way back when our group first ran thru Lord's of Oblivion I posted a few teasers reports from the adventure and mentioned that this particular installment was a relative cake-walk for the group. Yes, Vhalantru was supposed to be the BBEG at the end, but he really didn't amount to much. He had the tarterian template, which gave him the following: paralyzing slime (DC19 Fort save...not much of a challenge for big fighter and monk types, nor for dwarves); spell-like abilities( detect magic, clairaudience/clairvoyance, fear{again, DC 19}, invisibility, spider climb and tongues...all at will. 3/day...cloudkill, fog cloud, ray of enfeeblement, stinking cloud. 2/day...dispel magic. 1/day...charm monster); freedom of movement; see invisibility; immune to acid, mind-influence, and poison. Other than that, he was pretty much a standard beholder. All of the DC's on these abilities were relatively low, and he didn't have time to bring any of them to bear. The best situation for a beholder to be in, is to have a cadre of several big bruisers who don't need magic buffs to inflict lots of damage. Then, when the beholder cuts loose with the anti-magic cone, the meat puppets walk in a clean house. Vhalantru was all alone and hopelessly outnumbered and outpowered. IMO...a poorly designed climax.

Not to worry...I assure you the Bright Axes meet up with more than their fair share of challenges in the coming adventures. Why, in Strike on Shatterhorn alone I managed to take down Grimm, Dalthon, and Tilly in one fell swoop. That left Rusty, Kiko, Ike and Gunther...the B team...to save the day. It was touch and go there for awhile...a potentially campaign ending encounter. Yes, the BA's had their day in Lords of Oblivion, but up to this point in the SH, they haven't really met the Cagewrights yet. Stay tuned!

 

[monboesen]

On a related note. The party consist of 6? characters and a cohort. I believe they have above standard array (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8) scores.

What do you, as a DM, finds works best to adjust adjust the modules to a larger, more powerful group than its meant for.

I'm curious as I have a sort of similar situation (though with less character optimization).

 

[Mathew_Freeman]

Nice to have a chance to catch up with all this!

I see the reputation of the group has not been lessened. Still kickin' butt and takin' names! Huzzah!

 

[Joachim]

On a related note. The party consist of 6? characters and a cohort. I believe they have above standard array (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8) scores.

What do you, as a DM, finds works best to adjust adjust the modules to a larger, more powerful group than its meant for.

I'm curious as I have a sort of similar situation (though with less character optimization).

We do not use the standard array. We use a 32-point buy system, and it works out pretty well. When we do the standard 4d6-roll method, we almost always end up with substantially higher scores than with the 32 points. The modules can be given upgrades to larger number and higher level parties, so it gives JD some latitude to increase the level of the encounters.

Now, Monboesen, please tell me that your best answer to a powerful party is not to just 'whip out the Disjunctions.' I think you should probably look at upping the challenge, and not downgrading the power of your party. PC's at a certain level are _supposed_ to have a certain level of magic items, and removing them just for your convenience would be extremely frustrating. If a certain rule is broken (see Polymorph, version 3.0), then by all means fix it, but don't randomly punish PC's for putting together a fairly optimized character with a thoughtful selection of magic items. Chances are, the PC's you are wanting to disempower are going to be the ones who pass all of their saves (and keep all of their stuff) because they will have taken their saves into consideration and selected protective items and feats accordingly, while the underpowered (i.e. poorly-constructed) PC's (i.e. collateral damage) will be the ones who really eat the turd sandwich. And thus the snowball at the top of the hill begins to roll, and the strong continue on (getting stronger) while the weak continue dying (getting weaker).

Also, one thing that should not be missed is that the party is not supposed to have 'close calls' every single fight. It might make for good reading, but that, too, can be equally frustrating due to the expenditure of resources, increased number of resting periods, level loss associated with death and raising, etc.

MB, I'm sure you are not guilty of any of this, because I know you are a dutiful reader of this SH, and as such show better judgment.

Rant over.

 

[Neverwinter Knight]

First chance to comment: Great storytelling, JD !!! It's nice to see they finally used their brains to open the doors.
Also, Rusty's quote

"Well, this Tickle-butt Old-fart must be quite the muckety-muck to demand such tribute. Can’t say as I’ve heard of him though. Tell you what, we’ll give ya ten gold each and call it square. What do ya say?”

had me laughing my ass off !!!!!!

I was playing all of the NPCs in the Thifirane encounter. I thought I would inflict some major casualties but Rich and the gang really stuck it to me with some excellent tactics. I felt kind of bad, until I stuck it to them in Foundation of Flame.

If I remember correctly, there was only one big bad encounter in FoF. You don't mean...

 

[gfunk]

If I remember correctly, there was only one big bad encounter in FoF. You don't mean...

Yep, it was a take off on the old Snatch, Jerk and Breathe weightlifting manuever.

 

[Nightingale 7]

Hello again,Bright Axes!Congratulations on your smashing success.The beholder is indeed a rare specimen of a monster.It's spell-like abilities are powerful,indeed,but their pathetic HP's and AC make them easy prey for a well-prepared adventuring group.Also their big weapon,the antimagic cone negates their rest eye rays.It's an "if I use magic you do too,if I don't you don't either" kind of situation,and the beholders need big,magic-independent brutes to retain the edge.If a beholder decides to close the central eye,it has to be sure it will devastate the opposition with his eye rays,or a co-ordinated counterattack from the party is going to be deadly.It must also have ample space to bring it's natural flying ability to bear,so it can outmaneouvre it's opponents.In this encounter,Vhalantru was alone,in a closed space,without surprise on his side,and with a melee brute with 20ft melee reach,a monk(natural beholder-bane),and a blaster-sorcerer,among others.Taking all this in consideration,his easy defeat was not only natural,but a given.

Now,a dragon,THERE'S a creature to solo an adventuring party with!

 

[Joachim]

I felt kind of bad, until I stuck it to them in Foundation of Flame.

This is the equation for said encounter:

High Age Red Dragon + Broken Draconimicon Feats + Incomplete Printing of Broken Draconimicon Feats in Module (making feats more broken) + Party with No Time to Buff + Dragon with Time to Buff (only a couple of spells, but still) + Open Skies for Dragon to Breathe on Unbuffed Party - Party Has Full Spell Complement = ADVANTAGE: DRAGON

Now Gfunk, we all know you are better than that. I have seen you do much much worse with much less. Why would you need to crow about beating the party down (given the circumstances above) and not something that you actually earned?