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3.5 Kraken Variants

freyar

Explorer
Aha! We should stat out an "upate" sometime. :p

"Interdimensional Suggestion" seems to have the right flavor.

Any other thoughts for our tentacly Old One?
 

Cleon

Adventurer
Aha! We should stat out an "upate" sometime. :p
Your primitive mortal mind would not be able to comprehend the terror of that entity. :lol:

"Interdimensional Suggestion" seems to have the right flavor.
Updating the Khalk'ru Working Draft.

Any other thoughts for our tentacly Old One?
I'm OK moving on to the additional feats from its higher HD and Intelligence.

The original monster is so bare-bones it seems inappropriate piling on that much more in the way of special powers on it.

A simple and effective choice would be Dire Charge plus four Quicken Spell-Like Ability feats. With CL 20 it can quicken its chaos hammer, enervation, greater dispel magic, nightmare and mass suggestion spell-like abilities plus a few others that don't seem terribly useful as swift actions.

Of those five possibilities I'd drop chaos hammer, making the selection Quicken Spell-Like Ability (enervation, greater dispel magic, nightmare, mass suggestion).

If you'd like some different feat choices for the rest, my order-of-preference for the four remaining SLAs is enervation, nightmare, greater dispel magic and finally mass suggestion.
 

freyar

Explorer
I'd be happy with Dire Charge and the 4 Quicken SLAs you suggest.

I would just add to the Aspect's tactics. Maybe something like this:
Khalk'ru typically opens combat by making a Dire Charge at its most powerful opponent, grabbing and constricting if they survive. It then uses its Cleave and Combat Reflexes feats to try to hit as many opponents as possible and affect them with its touch of destruction ability, using quickened spell-like abilities at the same time. Khalk'ru uses its other spell-like abilities either in preparation for combat or if some opponents survive its initial onslaught without succumbing to its Maddening Presence and becoming Khalk'ru's ally and worshiper.
 

Cleon

Adventurer
I'd be happy with Dire Charge and the 4 Quicken SLAs you suggest.
Updating the Khalk'ru Working Draft.

I would just add to the Aspect's tactics. Maybe something like this:

Khalk'ru typically opens combat by making a Dire Charge at its most powerful opponent, grabbing and constricting if they survive. It then uses its Cleave and Combat Reflexes feats to try to hit as many opponents as possible and affect them with its touch of destruction ability, using quickened spell-like abilities at the same time. Khalk'ru uses its other spell-like abilities either in preparation for combat or if some opponents survive its initial onslaught without succumbing to its Maddening Presence and becoming Khalk'ru's ally and worshiper.
The basic concepts are OK but the phrasing is a bit clunky. Also, I think Maddening Presence makes more sense in the background info since 1d4 ability damage is hardly likely to knock down an opponent's Wisdom in one hit.

How about:

Khalk'ru typically opens combat by using Dire Charge and Great Cleave to try to strike as many opponents as possible with its tentacles while simultaneously barraging them with quickened spell-like abilities. If an enemy does not dissolve to Khalk'ru's touch of destruction the octopoid abomination switches to constriction attacks and its other spell-like abilities.
 

freyar

Explorer
Those tactics will be fine. But I don't see anything in Maddening Presence that limits it to 1d4 drain --- you have to make a save to be immune for 24 hours, so, if you fail the first save, you can fail and fail again. :devil:
 

Cleon

Adventurer
Those tactics will be fine. But I don't see anything in Maddening Presence that limits it to 1d4 drain --- you have to make a save to be immune for 24 hours, so, if you fail the first save, you can fail and fail again. :devil:
Oh right, I was remembering that the Interdimensional Suggestion involves exposure to its maddening presence as a once-per-long-time deal and thought the time limit was generic.

Actually, we forgot to include that bit in the Special Ability…

How about.

Khalk'ru typically opens combat by using Dire Charge and Great Cleave to try to strike as many opponents as possible with its tentacles while simultaneously barraging them with quickened spell-like abilities. If an enemy does not dissolve to Khalk'ru's touch of destruction the octopoid abomination switches to constriction attacks and its other spell-like abilities. When Khalk'ru is presented with opponents too feeble to pose a threat it occasionally holds off annihilating them and merely waits for its maddening presence special attack to transform those creatures into its insane worshipers.

Also:

Interdimensional Suggestion (Sp): Once per week, Khalk'ru may use suggestion as a spell-like ability on a creature located on a different plane of existence, provided that the target creature knows of Khalk'ru's existence. This exposes the suggestion's target to Khalk'ru's maddening presence ability (see below).
 

freyar

Explorer
I like it!

I will guess you have some thoughts on description and background. As you say, there isn't a lot to go on. Maybe we can just extend what we did for the aspect a little.

I just noticed an inconsistency --- the single attack has a 3d8 tentacle, but the full attack has 2d8 tentacles. And it only has a +15 Str bonus to the tentacle damage, while the aspect has the 1-1/2 Str bonus. I think I'd go with the +22 bonus, but I'm divided on whether we should actually increase to 3d8 damage (which I'm guessing is a typo).

So that leaves CR. I'm just eyeballing somewhere in the 24-26 range. Do you agree?
 

Cleon

Adventurer
I like it!
Updating the Khalk'ru Working Draft.

I will guess you have some thoughts on description and background. As you say, there isn't a lot to go on. Maybe we can just extend what we did for the aspect a little.
I don't have anything specific worked out. There's some things in the original novel we could crib from, like the "magic items" made of yellow glass used by the cult of Khalk'ru (a ring, altar and a giant "window"), which are used in combination to summon Khalk'ru to the Prime Material Plane.

I just noticed an inconsistency --- the single attack has a 3d8 tentacle, but the full attack has 2d8 tentacles. And it only has a +15 Str bonus to the tentacle damage, while the aspect has the 1-1/2 Str bonus. I think I'd go with the +22 bonus, but I'm divided on whether we should actually increase to 3d8 damage (which I'm guessing is a typo).
They should both be 3d8+15.

3d8 because it's a size larger than the Aspect which has 2d8 tentacles. The damage bonus is only 1 times Str because that's the standard rule for multiple primary attacks.

So that leaves CR. I'm just eyeballing somewhere in the 24-26 range. Do you agree?
It's very hard to tell. It's got plenty of devastating attacks but is a bit weak on defence. CR 25 is as good as any other arbitrary number.

Speaking of defenses, we need to upgrade the spell resistance as it's still only got the aspect's SR 25.

Maybe SR 35?
 

freyar

Explorer
3d8+15 works for me!

I can agree to SR 35 also (to go with CR 25).

So I guess we need to move to the description and flavor.
 

freyar

Explorer
Hmmm. Proposed description: A massive kraken-like being

Background: Khalk'ru the Dissolver is a terrifying extraplanar entity whose only interest in the Material Plane is its destruction. ....

I also just noticed in the Aspect's background that we need to change "who's"" as in "who is" to "whose" possessive.
 

Cleon

Adventurer
Hmmm. Proposed description: A massive kraken-like being
I think we can make that a bit more colourful:

A titanic octopoidal horror with a dozen tentacles as long as ships and a globular body the size of a building. The creature floats in the air as if it were in water. Its skin is blacker than black, its only colour is the red of its unfathomably malevolent eyes whose piercing gaze seems to see your every sin and weakness.

Background: Khalk'ru the Dissolver is a terrifying extraplanar entity whose only interest in the Material Plane is its destruction. ....
Khalk'ru is a terrifying extraplanar entity whose only interest in the Material Plane is its annihilation. It is known by many titles, including The Dissolver, The Eater-Up of Life, The End-Without-End, The Living Nothingness and The Lightless Timeless Void. The Dissolver is able to subtly influence mortals on the Prime Material Plane, creating insane cults who call upon Khalk'ru to destroy sacrifices or enemies and beg it to spare them. The worst of these cultists dream of summoning their lord to destroy all of creation, but fortunately most cults of The Dissolver are only able to summon an aspect of Khalk'ru (as detailed below). There are several magical items associated with The Living Nothingness, relics of a lost civilization of Khalk'ru worshippers whose nihilism destroyed them.

Khalk'ru is roughly 150 feet across, from tentacle-tip to tentacle-tip.

I also just noticed in the Aspect's background that we need to change "who's"" as in "who is" to "whose" possessive.
Updating the Khalk'ru Working Draft.

Fixed.
 

Cleon

Adventurer
That all looks great to me! Are we done in that case?
I think we're done, but I'll do a quick check just to be sure…

Well I found a couple of typos (a UK spelling of "colour" and a "Disollver" that should be "Dissolver" but the only technical error I could find was I forgot to include "quickened" in their four 3/day quickened SLAs.

Updating the Khalk'ru Working Draft.

Anyway that's done, so we're ready to proceed with the next Kraken!
 

Cleon

Adventurer
If we continue to follow the order of the Krakens in post #1 of this thread, the next one is the Mystaran Kraken. This is basically a stupider larger Kraken.

I'll post the original stats.
 

Cleon

Adventurer
Mystaran Kraken Original Stats

KRAKEN
[TABLE="width: 500"]
[TR]
[TD]Armor Class:
[/TD]
[TD]0[/TD]
[TD]Save As:[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]Fighter: 36[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Hit Dice:[/TD]
[TD]64* (plus tentacles)[/TD]
[TD]Morale:[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]10[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Move (Swimming):[/TD]
[TD]240′ (80′)[/TD]
[TD]Treasure Type:[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]G + H[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Attacks:[/TD]
[TD]1-10 tentacles/1 bite[/TD]
[TD]Intelligence:[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]5[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Damage:[/TD]
[TD]7-42 per tentacle/8-80[/TD]
[TD]Alignment:[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]Chaotic[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]No. Appearing:[/TD]
[TD]0 (1-4)[/TD]
[TD]XP Value:[/TD]
[TD="align: right"]26,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

The kraken is one of the largest of all creatures; the body is over 150′ long, and each of its 10 huge tentacles can reach up to a range of 750′. It usually remain, deep under the sea, reaching up from the depths to attack large prey, passing ships, and even low-flying creatures. It is greenish-blue, and when it floats on the surface (a rare occasion), it appears identical to a mass of kelp.

When a kraken attacks a ship, it wraps six of its tentacles around the craft and attacks crew members with the remaining four. Each tentacle inflicts 7-42 points of damage (half damage, in hull points, to the vessel). The six tentacles hold on to the ship, automatically inflicting 7d6 points of constriction damage each round. Once the boat has been crushed, the kraken attacks the survivors with all tentacles. The victims are drawn to the monster's cavernous mouth in 2-8 rounds. Any victim caught has a -4 penalty to all Hit Rolls, hut may attack the tentacle (60 hit points each, in addition to the body's 64 Hit Dice) to attempt to escape.

If the kraken loses 5 or more tentacles, it releases all its victims and flees, releasing a 1000′ x 1000′ cloud of ink for obscurement. This cloud blinds all creatures for as long as they remain within it.
 
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Cleon

Adventurer
Okay this looks fairly straightforward.

It is basically a SRD Giant Octopus or Giant Squid magnified to Colossal++ size and with a 3-point boost to its Intelligence.

I've also remembered there's another giant cephalopod that probably belongs in this thread - the Leviathan of Nehwon, which is pretty much a 40 HD Giant Octopus. I think I'll add it to the list.

Anyhow, getting back to the Mystaran Kraken should we make it an Animal or a Magical Beast? The description doesn't give it any supernatural abilities unless you count its extraordinary size or the ability to imitate kelp but it IS in the "Monsters and Other Fantastical Creatures" section of AC9 rather than the Animals: Mundane, Extinct and Giant" section.

Then again, that section does include a few extinct animals like the Phororhacus and Grangeri - which are pretty obviously Phorusrhacos and Paraceratherium (previously known as the Baluchitherium and Indricotherium, under which name they have AD&D and 3E stats).

So do you prefer Animal (Aquatic) or Magical Beast (Aquatic) for the Mystaran Kraken's type?

I'm inclined to give it a Size/Reach larger than the standard 30/30 for a Colossal creature considering the original's ridiculous dimensions, which also suggests we should bump up the Strength and Constitution to impressive numbers.
 

freyar

Explorer
Colossal+ is fun!
If we're keeping Int 5, it has to be a magical beast. So that's my vote. :)
We should definitely give it bigger space/reach, and I also certainly agree to increasing Str and Con. Did you have thoughts on that?
 

Cleon

Adventurer
Colossal+ is fun!
If we're keeping Int 5, it has to be a magical beast. So that's my vote. :)
We should definitely give it bigger space/reach, and I also certainly agree to increasing Str and Con. Did you have thoughts on that?
Agreed. Magical Beast it is then.

We should definitely give it bigger space/reach, and I also certainly agree to increasing Str and Con. Did you have thoughts on that?
I'd go whole hog and honour the original's 150-yard long tentacles with a Reach of 750 ft. with tentacles.

The beastie's body is "over 150′ long" so I fancy a hefty 150 ft. Space. Now the SRD Giant Squid has a body "more than 20 feet long" and has a 15 ft. Space so it could have a 120 ft. Space but that seems a bit small in proportion to the tentacle reach. Even 150 feet is one-fifth the tentacle reach, which is a ratio significantly higher than the standard giant cephalopods - the Giant Octopus and Giant Squid are both 2:1 (10 ft. vs. 20 ft. tentacle reach or 15 ft. vs. 30 ft.), while the Kraken is 3:1 (20 ft. vs. 60 ft.).

Actually… I'd be game making the Space larger than 150 ft. if you prefer. A 3:1 ratio like the Kraken's would give a 250 ft. Space.

Anyhow, for the sake of argument I'll proceed with a Space/Reach of 150 ft./50 ft. (750 ft. with tentacle).

Now the Mystaran Kraken has a Space 7.5 times wider than a Kraken. That suggests its roughly the equivalent of three "size categories" bigger (or eight times wide) since the dimensions double with each size increase.

Normal size advancement for three size categories is +24 Str and +12 Con, which would make it Str 58, Con 41 if applied to the Kraken's Str 34, Con 29.

However, its tentacles 12.5 longer than a regular Kraken so it may be more like 3½ size-doublings, giving it Str 62, Con 42.

Compared to a Giant Octopus, it's 15 times wider and has tentacles 32.5 longer, suggesting either four to five "dimension doublings" for somewhere between +32 Str, +16 Con and +40 Str, +20 Con to the Giant Octopus's Str 20, Con 13, resulting in Str 52-60, Con 29-33.

A Giant Squid is inbetween, being 10 times wider with tentacles 25 times longer is something like 3¼ to 4½ "doublings". Let's call it as between +26 Str, +13 Con and +36 Str, +18 Con to the Giant Squid's Str 26, Con 13, resulting in Str 52-62, Con 26-31.

I'm inclined to be conservative and go for the lowest figures in that range and make it Str 52-53, Con 30-31.

Dexterity 13 like a Gargantuan+ Giant Squid seems appropriate.

Intelligence 5 has already been decided.

For Charisma and Wisdom how about averaging a Kraken's 20 with a Giant Squid/Octopus's Wis 12, Cha 3 or 2?

That'd be Wisdom 16, Charisma 11-12.

Put together that's Str 52, Dex 13, Con 31, Int 5, Wis 16, Cha 12

I think I'll start a Working Draft.
 

Cleon

Adventurer
Kraken, Mystaran
Colossal Magical Beast (Aquatic)
Hit Dice: 64d10+640 (992 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: Swim 80? ft. (16 squares)
Armor Class: ?? (–8 size, +1 Dex, +?? natural), touch 2, flat-footed ??
Base Attack/Grapple: +64/+101
Attack: Tentacle +77 melee (?d?+21)
Full Attack: Ten tentacles +77 melee (?d?+21) and bite +72 melee (?d?+10)
Space/Reach: 150 ft./ 50 ft. (750 ft. with tentacle)
Special Attacks: Constrict ?d?+21, expert grappler, improved grab
Special Qualities: Darkvision ??? ft., [camouflage? (as kelp)], ink cloud, jet, superior low-light vision?
Saves: Fort +44, Ref +35, Will +24
Abilities: Str 52, Dex 13, Con 31, Int 5, Wis 16, Cha 12
Skills: [67 SPs] Listen +, Spot +, Swim +29
Feats: 22 feats
Environment: Any aquatic
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: ??
Treasure: [Standard? Double standard? Maybe even Triple Standard???]
Alignment: Usually chaotic evil?
Advancement: 65-128 HD (Colossal)? [maybe 65-192 or 65+]
Level Adjustment:

Description.

Background.

Dimensions.

Combat
Tactics.

Constrict (Ex): A Mystaran kraken deals automatic tentacle damage with a successful grapple check.

Expert Grappler (Ex): If a Mystaran kraken chooses to grapple an opponent but remain ungrappled itself it only takes a –10 penalty on its grapple checks instead of the normal –20 penalty. It may then make tentacle attacks as normal.

Jet (Ex): A Mystaran kraken can jet backward once per round as a full-round action, at a speed of 320 feet. It must move in a straight line, but does not provoke attacks of opportunity while jetting.

Ink Cloud (Ex): A Mystaran kraken can emit a cloud of jet-black ink in an 1000-foot spread once per minute as a free action. The cloud provides total concealment, which the kraken normally uses to escape a fight that is going badly. Creatures within the cloud are considered to be in darkness.

[Needs some kind of "Kelp Disguise" power]

Superior Low-Light Vision (Ex): A Mystaran kraken can see ten times as far as a human can in dim light.

Skills: A Mystaran kraken has a +8 racial bonus on any Swim check to perform some special action or avoid a hazard. It can always choose to take 10 on a Swim check, even if distracted or endangered. It can use the run action while swimming, provided it swims in a straight line.

Originally appeared in AC9 - Creature Catalogue (1986)
 
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