Law and Chaos Nonsensical, Consequences of Removing Them?

[ivocaliban]

Strange...

I prefer to remove Good and Evil from my campaigns instead of Law & Chaos.

If anything, Law and Chaos are -FAR- more easily defined than Good and Evil. And I'm a big Michael Moorcock junky...

Good points all around.

I really liked the fact that Rokugan (L5R) emphasized the Law/Chaos axis over Good/Evil. It's a very important distinction that defines the setting. Besides, can you have a world inhabited by man where there are no laws and yet no chaos? This could get significantly philosophic and at 5:30am and no sleep I haven't the concentration for it.

 

[Turanil]

Heck, just switch to the Allegiances system from d20 Modern. Saves a lot of trouble.

I have no problem with the normal definition of law-chaos in the corerule for playing a traditional D&D game, but otherwise much agree with Kesh, that the allegiance system is much more flexible and interesting.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

I don't know who posted this, but I got this from some thread here on Enworld.

So, now that Law and Chaos, IMO, have been proven to be nonsensical, what are the consequences of removing or de-emphasizing them from the Core rules? Or maybe coming up with a new definition of Law and Chaos?

I could:
1. Remove Law vs. Chaos
2. Redefine it so it is meaningful.

Yeah, right, proven...
I really don't think so, you may or may not agree with his arguments, but they are not proof, so please don't say that they are. They are an opinion, nothing more, and there are other opinions.

That said, I prefer the allegiances in D20 Modern, but for D&D Law and Chaos work just fine, I find them a better guide to behavior for a character than Good and Evil, and easier to role play. And that n a nutshell is why they exist, as a quick guide to the behavior of the character.

The Auld Grump

 

[MonsterMash]

I've never particularly liked the Alignment system in D&D particularly after it got moved from the three to nine alignments with the Law-Chaos and Good-Evil axes. On the whole I like the Alliegances in D20Modern, and the Conan RPG system of Alleigances, Codes of Honour, and reputations and am looking to fit this into my Wilderlands campaign with a reduced aligment system.

 

[cmanos]

I have to disagree with whomever initially posted this. IMHO I think the Law v Chaos battle is a stronger battle than the Good v Evil battle. I don't "like" the alignment system, but people don't really understand the battle between Law (structure) and Chaos (Entropy). I haven't fully thought out my argument on this, and when I do, you better beleive I'll be posting it here.

 

[VirgilCaine]

Since this is the third time I'm writing this because of computer glitches, I'll keep it short.

Removing L/C doesn't seem to be a big problem, only about five or ten spells to worry about, really.
I think I will remove Law/Chaos from mortal ken--Modrons and Slaad are almost the only Lawful/Chaotic creatures, and Chaos Hammers, etc. just detect/hurt/not hurt Slaad/Modrons.

I'm not interested in anti-removal arguments but someone else might be, so bring them on.