Leadership (da feat) question

[Aloïsius]

If you bother to download and read the DMG errata; they say you must add a Special paragraph to the Leadership feat saying "you can take the feat multiple time, "getting additional cohorts and stacking number of followers".

Incidentally, I have a character who intend on taking that feat several times (at 6th level, then later at maybe 15th...).

 

[Mistwell]

If you bother to download and read the DMG errata; they say you must add a Special paragraph to the Leadership feat saying "you can take the feat multiple time, "getting additional cohorts and stacking number of followers".

Incidentally, I have a character who intend on taking that feat several times (at 6th level, then later at maybe 15th...).

I "bothered" to download the DMG errata, and found no reference to the feat whatsoever in the entire errata.

 

[mroberon1972]

Nope...

I saw nothing in the errata either. What are you talking about?

 

[Aloïsius]

About Cohort and Followers' class, race, and alignment; read page 46 the definition of them:

"A character can try to attract a cohort of a particular race, class, and alignment. [...] The cohort has gear as an NPC [...]."

And:

"Followers can be warriors, experts, or commoners. The leader can generally choose their races and classes*. A leader attracts followers whose alignments are within one step of his own."

(* What idiot will ever want commoner followers ? Experts and warriors OK, but commoners, they included it only because it would not have been logical to exclude them. The fact that aristocrats are out seems logical, those with that class are people who give order, not people who receive them; but they could have let adepts in. Maybe they didn't wanted to allow spellcasting followers. Just take gnome followers...)

They also say you should refer to the Cohorts section of Chapter 5: Campaigns (page 147) for more on cohorts and followers. That section was probably written before the feat, because no references to it are made and they suggest different ways (RP, pay, and negociation) to attract cohorts. Don't say anything about followers. I would suggest that cohorts should be considered fanatic ("seeking no reward but the opportunity to serve alongside the [leader] PC" and followers to be similarly "fanatic" (requiring only living costs) hirelings.

The ELH probably have an extended Leadership table, since the normal feat only allow followers of 6th level (with a Leadership score of at least 21), because Prestige Classes usually requires to be at least 5th level to qualify, and 6+4>6.

 

[Mr Fidgit]

Aloisius, could you post a link to the information you have? the DMG errata i have goes from pg 40, apprentice saves to pg 50, changing magic item names. (with nothing in between)

 

[Pax]

Mr Fidgit: open your DMG, that's where Fiolus got his information from. I have a first-printing DMG, and his quotes match, word for word, what's in mine, too.

I agree. However, I would appreciate it if you (or someone else) could offer evidence to support this statement.

My friend and I are both horrible rules lawyers, so evidence is necessary. It's a syndrome, really.

-F

DMG page 45, "Leadership" sidebar. Left-hand column, last paragraph, emphasis mine:

Cohort Level: The character can attract a cohort of up to this level. Regardless of the character's Leadership score, he can't recruit a cohort of his level orhigher. A 6th-level paladin with a +3 Charisma bonus, for example, can still only recruit a cohort of 5thlevel or lower.

Three times, that passage, which specifically deals with the level of a recruited cohort, uses the singular form. Zero times, ituses the plural form.

Further, table 2-25, on that same page, details both the Cohort maximum level and the number of followers a given leadership score can attract.

Nowhere is there specifically defined a maximum number of cohorts you can gain per Leadership feat, per se. This is because a single cohort is the implicit benefit of the feat.

IF the feat allowed you limitless cohorts for taking the feat once ... what would be the point of limiting the number of FOLLOWERS ... ? After all, with a Leadership Score of (for example) 8, you could have a 5th level Cohort, but NO followers.

By your reading of the rules, you could have TWO HUNDRED 5th level cohorts, but still couldn't get a single "follower", with that Leadership Score of 8.

Logic and rational examination with an eye to game balance. As a GM, I -might- allow a second cohort, at half the leadership score, if the ability to gain followers were given up entirely. IOW, 1 cohort and a variable number of followers, or, two cohorts, one significantly weaker than the others.

 

[Pax]

The ELH probably have an extended Leadership table, since the normal feat only allow followers of 6th level (with a Leadership score of at least 21), because Prestige Classes usually requires to be at least 5th level to qualify, and 6+4>6.

Yes, it does, on page 37. However, that table only applies if you take the Epic Leadership feat. This allows followers of aNY level, the trick being that at Leadership Score 40 you get 1000 1st-level followers and a 25th level cohort.

Per point beyond 40th, you get +100 1st-level followers, and + 1/2 a level for your cohort (IOW, the Cohort Level increases by 1, per +2 to Leadership Score above 40).

Based on the 1st-level Followers, you get 1/10 as many 2d level followers. From there, each +1 level, halves the number of followers you get, round up, except for fractions less than 1 (which round down). Which means a 100th level, uber-charisma Paladin has QUITE the personal army -- especially with Legendary Commander (10x as many followers!!).

 

[Mr Fidgit]

Mr Fidgit: open your DMG, that's where Fiolus got his information from.

hey pax! who's Fiolus?

 

[Pax]

hey pax! who's Fiolus?

A bad typo, and n/m anyway, I misread which post you were referring to anyway.

 

[Mistwell]

This is the quote we are all disputing:

If you bother to download and read the DMG errata; they say you must add a Special paragraph to the Leadership feat saying "you can take the feat multiple time, "getting additional cohorts and stacking number of followers".

Incidentally, I have a character who intend on taking that feat several times (at 6th level, then later at maybe 15th...).

As far as I can tell, Aloïsius pulled this out of his butt. I think it is a good rule to add, and Monte Cook's comment agrees with it. However, it isn't in any errata I have seen.