I think that loosing XP to make magical items is a crap idea.Why should u loose your memories of an adventurer to make say a wand or whatever.Isnt Experience the knowlendge of what you have done. If i went to make a table i wonder forget how to make a chair now would I. Can anyone flesh this one out pls
Loosing XP in item making
- Thread starter Anditch
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Chronosome
Explorer
Well, it should cost something, don't you think?
You could always house rule it so it costs more money--instead of XP. There are some guidelines for converting XP costs to gp costs in a recent Dragon magazine...the one with the Sculpt Self feat and "Prestige Races".
Hope you find an alternative you're happy with.
You could always house rule it so it costs more money--instead of XP. There are some guidelines for converting XP costs to gp costs in a recent Dragon magazine...the one with the Sculpt Self feat and "Prestige Races".
Hope you find an alternative you're happy with.
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Trainz@work
First Post
I agree that there isn't a "logical" in-game reason for having an X.P. cost, but not doing so is opening one Pandora's Box that you would find very hard to close.
I will keep the X.P. cost, if only for balance reasons.
I will keep the X.P. cost, if only for balance reasons.
jodyjohnson
Adventurer
Well the previous system was
1) Decide to make item and inform the DM
2) DM takes your character out of the campaign while you a) hunt strange parts, b) craft said item.
3) Meanwhile the rest of the party earns XP, cash, and gets 'free' items.
4a) LOSE 1 CON - thanks Infinitude
4) End result you lost XP and cash because you were forced to miss adventuring (XP generation) in order to make an item that was probably worse than your party was getting in a typical encounter.
So 3.0 basically standardized the mechanic to just say lose 1/25 of cost in XP (usually much less than opportunity costs in 1e and 2e) and set a standard gold cost.
Most campaigns that don't like the XP cost revert to the original version and make the creator and/or party pay opportunity costs (in XP and gold) instead.
In game terms, you pay XP because XP is a gauge of your character's power and imbuing uses up character power.
1) Decide to make item and inform the DM
2) DM takes your character out of the campaign while you a) hunt strange parts, b) craft said item.
3) Meanwhile the rest of the party earns XP, cash, and gets 'free' items.
4a) LOSE 1 CON - thanks Infinitude
4) End result you lost XP and cash because you were forced to miss adventuring (XP generation) in order to make an item that was probably worse than your party was getting in a typical encounter.
So 3.0 basically standardized the mechanic to just say lose 1/25 of cost in XP (usually much less than opportunity costs in 1e and 2e) and set a standard gold cost.
Most campaigns that don't like the XP cost revert to the original version and make the creator and/or party pay opportunity costs (in XP and gold) instead.
In game terms, you pay XP because XP is a gauge of your character's power and imbuing uses up character power.
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splitinfinitude
First Post
You could pay a point of con like in the old rules. I'd rather give up the xp.
There's a logical, in-game reasooning behing XP, so long as you don't think of XP as plain old mundane "knowledge". When you consider how far above and beyond the abilities of normal mortals a high-level character can get, this doesn't seem so odd.
Some of what you gain in XP isn't mere "knowledge". It is something more ineffible - heroism, life force, "epicness", call it what you will. A high level character doesn't just "learn" how to survive the searing flames of a high-level fireball. It's something else about him that allows him to stand up to that kind of punishment. It's that extra quality, that portion of his soul or spirit, that a spellcaster puts into a magic item.
Some of what you gain in XP isn't mere "knowledge". It is something more ineffible - heroism, life force, "epicness", call it what you will. A high level character doesn't just "learn" how to survive the searing flames of a high-level fireball. It's something else about him that allows him to stand up to that kind of punishment. It's that extra quality, that portion of his soul or spirit, that a spellcaster puts into a magic item.
problem
The problem that I always had with this was that an old wizard could not sit around his shop and make scrolls and potions for a career after he has retired from adventuring. Doing a craft should give you experience in the craft. If we really wanted to symbolize life force or power being drained away why not artificially age a character? It may be harsh but to me it makes more sense.
I guess the big problem is that we should be looking at it in terms of game balance instead of real life mechanics. After all...how many people do know that made a wand of magic missles in real life?
The problem that I always had with this was that an old wizard could not sit around his shop and make scrolls and potions for a career after he has retired from adventuring. Doing a craft should give you experience in the craft. If we really wanted to symbolize life force or power being drained away why not artificially age a character? It may be harsh but to me it makes more sense.
I guess the big problem is that we should be looking at it in terms of game balance instead of real life mechanics. After all...how many people do know that made a wand of magic missles in real life?
Re: problem
Well, maybe he can. The Core Rules do have an option for "power components". If the DM likes it, he can have a person who buys certain components for ink, uses them to write scrolls, which he sells. You can look at the Craft skill rules to figure out a reasonable price for the power components.
Of course, now you've introduced a mechanic by which a PC can have nigh infinite scrolls. So, you may only want to apply this for spells with little combat potiential.
SmCaudata said:
Well, maybe he can. The Core Rules do have an option for "power components". If the DM likes it, he can have a person who buys certain components for ink, uses them to write scrolls, which he sells. You can look at the Craft skill rules to figure out a reasonable price for the power components.
Of course, now you've introduced a mechanic by which a PC can have nigh infinite scrolls. So, you may only want to apply this for spells with little combat potiential.
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Voadam
Legend
One way to explain the xp loss is that the permanent infusion of magical power into an item requires an infusion of part of the animating life force and soul power of the creator.
There are plenty of legends that a maker of a magic item puts part of his soul into his creation to power it, this sets up a mechanic for that and makes it the default.
It's true that a spellcrafter can't create an infinite amount of magical items, it will always hold a personal cost to create an item under the default system.
Minor magic items, however, can be made without a feat or xp, continual flame can make an everburning torch, illusory wall can create a magical trap cover for a pit, and permanent and programmed illusions can do some neat effects. Fire traps, glyphs of warding, etc.
There are plenty of legends that a maker of a magic item puts part of his soul into his creation to power it, this sets up a mechanic for that and makes it the default.
It's true that a spellcrafter can't create an infinite amount of magical items, it will always hold a personal cost to create an item under the default system.
Minor magic items, however, can be made without a feat or xp, continual flame can make an everburning torch, illusory wall can create a magical trap cover for a pit, and permanent and programmed illusions can do some neat effects. Fire traps, glyphs of warding, etc.
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