Lost 5/2/07 "The Brig" (spoilers)

Demmero said:
It still feels "off" to me. Why didn't he try to con Sawyer into releasing him and maybe trying to escape together? That would seem like the logical move to me. Instead, Locke's dad seemed to almost turn into an 'anti-Other,' spouting too much information for his own good. It was almost like he wanted to give Sawyer a reason to kill him. Maybe he really believed he was dead and in hell...or maybe something else is afoot.

See, I think that's it- he really did believe he was already dead and that nothing mattered anymore, and he was just acting out against the situation. Which is why I wish that Sawyer had done something more than strangle him- to really let it sink in that he wasn't dead, and that his actions would still have some worldly consequences. (Not that it probably didn't strike him as he was slowly being choked, but something more long term would have been more suitable, IMO, for the despicable human being he was.)
 

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IcedEarth81 said:
Ben played Locke like a fiddle in this episode. I don't know why he would want Sawyer to kill Cooper, but he definately got Locke to do that.
You either drink the kool aid or you don't, red pill or green, it was the choice. If Locke killed his father, Benry knew he would be his to control. Locke found a way without breaking his word. Ben knows how far Locke can be pushed, it makes it easier the next time. I think the public display was to weaken Locke in the eyes of the Others and for Ben to mantain his power.

The surprise may come when Ben finds out it was not Locke to do the deed.
 

Taelorn76 said:
You know for the writers saying that the survivors are not dead or in Purgatory, they sure throw that out there alot.
Yeah Iknow. I"m still not ruling it out. They may not be the the traditional sense of purgatory, who knows.

Good episode all around. I hope that its not a "fakes plane crash" because that is just unbelievable. I don't think a press release and a couple of photos is i going to fool a search party looking for the plane. It would be as if the searchers said, "ok found the plane lets go on to something else".

I'd like an island explanation for it.
 

It struck me too...watching the Others gather eagerly to watch Locke cut a helpless man's throat...however just that death might be.

But then I was thinking. No one ever, EVER, addressed the morality of killing a man. Ben, at the end, goaded Locke by recounting his father's crimes and mocking him, but until then no one had phrased the quandry in light of its ethical or moral implications, nor from the standpoint of justice.

It was ALWAYS addressed from a perspective of "Locke needs to do this, so Locke can move on." It's for Locke that this must be done. To free him from his past.

Now, that sort of thing can be a brainwashing technique. Where you pressure someone into doing something really awful, that they can't justify or rationalize to themselves UNLESS they totally accept the will of the group and their own subordinate role to it. But given the other events on the island, it struck me that the Others might actually be onto something here.

Ben lies easily and constantly, sure, but even the Devil can tell the truth for his own purposes.

When Ben spoke of Locke "bringing him here," in reference to his father, I started wondering...just who is this guy tied to a pole (and that stone ruin was -incredibly- out of place, don'tcha think? Old temple pillar? Huh?) for him to kill? Was it Locke's father? Or an -image- of Locke's father? A manifestation? A projection, somehow, of the 'father' that lives in Locke's head, holding him back, demanding to be dealt with.

I don't think he was a real guy. To me, that explains a lot about the -utter- lack of concern the Others showed towards him...not even addressing him or looking him in the eye. Only knocking him out so he can't say too much. Jack's dad was the same way. A lot of the other things on the island are too, I think. The 'magic box' doesn't just give you what you THINK you want...it gives you what you deep down subconsciously want. And what Locke wanted...almost as much as to walk again (which he got too) was to square things AT LAST with his dad.

How does he know about being in a car accident and so on? I have two ideas about that. One is that it could be just made up...details from his fantasies or speculation from his unconscious. The other is that, by that time, our con man had TWO authors...Locke AND Sawyer. He was unusual in that he was the focus of two men's vendettas, and it's possible that Sawyer knows something Locke (and we) don't. I also kind of wonder if Locke might have heard of a car accident involving his dad...

And yeah, it doesn't pass the Razor test. :) It just has seemed to me that there's been SOME kind of psychoreactive element to the island from Season 1. It might also explain why the con man was so...forthcoming to Sawyer. *shrug*
 

If she is an other, they don't have to fake the mini-subs and photos and wreckage and bodies. They just have to blast helicopter crashing sounds from offshore and have a light up in the air that leads them to where they plant her in a tree. Mikale conveniently comes along to "help" here (or help convince the Lostaways)


Since people don't stay dead all of the time, maybe Locke's dad isn't really dead either.
 

The public display and threats of leaving him behind were to "encourage" Locke to carry out his task. What task was that? Not to kill his father, but to get Sawyer to. I don't buy the stuff that the other that handed him Sawyer's file said. He said Ben was wasting their time with the fertility stuff, but wasn't he the one that recruiting Juliet so hard? It makes more sense for Ben to be manipulating this entire situation to his liking. I don't know what he has planned, but it's probably not very good for the castaways.
 

DonTadow said:
I hope that its not a "fakes plane crash" because that is just unbelievable. I don't think a press release and a couple of photos is i going to fool a search party looking for the plane. It would be as if the searchers said, "ok found the plane lets go on to something else".
Since they had to use a remote mini-sub thing to take the photos, the only thing needed was for the company that owns and operates the remote camera. A company, say owned by the Hanso organization.
 

Plus, it is not like they don't have the other 815 crash victims here and there that did not make it to the island. Only have to provide a couple of bodies.

Talk about a sweet scam, they could milk the families, businesses and countries on the cost on the recovery of the bodies...just pull some from the water every couple of months! :heh:
 

Arnwyn said:
They all keep their mouths shut and don't tell each other anything... and then the one time when someone is supposed to keep their fat yap shut, they go and tell an Other that there's someone new here that might know how to get off the island. Okay, dumbasses, does the island make you stupid?

I don't think the island made Kate stupid....I think *love* made her stupid. Her whole little thing with Sawyer seems almost like he's "seconds" for her. I still think she wants Jack, and her whole thing with Sawyer almost seems like retaliation because Jack is spending all this time with Juliet. For that matter, given that she knows (from Juliet) that women who get pregnant on the island all die, you'd think that she'd be keeping her clothes on when around Sawyer, since there is no birth control, and apparently pregnancy is a death sentence...

Banshee
 

Demmero said:
Of course, Cooper did say that he'd been rammed from behind on a freeway shortly before waking up a captive on the island, so maybe he is dead like Jack's father and Eko's brother. But that then begs the question of whether or not Locke or Sawyer can actually kill someone who's already dead ;)

It could also mean that the Others have significant resources off-island, and used Locke's file to find out about his father, and Benry decided to have someone track down the dad, fake an accident, and use a fake ambulance crew to kidnap him.....all in order to get leverage over Locke....

Banshee
 

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