LOTR from a gamer's perspective

[Templetroll]

A flight of eagles was there to save the dwarves in The Hobbit, and one saved Gandalf from Saruman. They were an underutilized resource.
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I don't know the passage in the trilogy or in the Hobbit but there was something about the pride of the Eagles and the fact that they did not like to be ridden or help those on the ground.

The Eagles were not a resource, they were a race of creatures with their own thoughts and part of it was to stay out of the wars of Men and Elves as much as they could. They were not things to be summoned or a resource to be utilized. They only showed up the few times they did based on their assessment of the need and decision by them to assist Gandalf and his people.

If Gandalf had broached the idea of flying into Mordor early on he would have been rebuffed and they would not have had the help of Eagles ever again.

 

[Darth Shoju]

A. The best at what?
B. Whoever was writing the story at the time decided that.
C. That's even a debate?

A. Whatever trekkies value the most?
B. Me and my friends when we were 10
C. LOL not as far as I am concerned, yet it is a contentious issue on the net as far as I can tell.



(sorry for the derailing)

 

[Gentlegamer]

What gamer destroys loot? Claim the ring as your own!!

And become the new Dark Lord.

 

[Darth Shoju]

They shuffled the setting a bunch, and the result was something that was playable after the War of Souls, IMO.

But, they didn't stop there. They just keep shaking up the world. It also pains me since the authors they use for lots of it don't seem to have any notion of the Dragonlance feel. Even when they're authors that have written for DL for a long time. The Solamnia novels, the Wizard book, all just make the world worse and drove me away.

YMMV

Sorry to hear that. But that speaks to one of the main differences between a story like LoTR and a good D&D campaign: a good story draws the reader in and immerses them in the world while leaving room for their imagination to work-yet it does so on the author's terms. A story is not collaborative nor is it a game. D&D *is* a game, it is a collaboration and, in my opinion, it needs to have exactly as many authors as it has participants (DM and player alike). With a story, those who enjoy it do so for what it is and how it meets their own tastes and interpretations; when you try to take such a personal idea and open it up as a collaborative world, you challenge those personal interpretations and are often left with something at least somewhat unsatisfying to many of the original fans.

And this problem is magnified with a story as revered as LoTR; any other fan's LoTR isn't *my* LotR. When I close my eyes and picture Valinor, I doubt it matches up to the next fan's image. This is why I think the LoTR movies are such an achievement; to take something so sacred and craft a visual interpretation of it that so many enjoy is nothing short of monumental IMO.

That, and any self-respecting D&D player would have finished off Shelob and raided her lair, then looted Frodo's "corpse".

Just saying is all.

 

[Vocenoctum]

And this problem is magnified with a story as revered as LoTR; any other fan's LoTR isn't *my* LotR. When I close my eyes and picture Valinor, I doubt it matches up to the next fan's image. This is why I think the LoTR movies are such an achievement; to take something so sacred and craft a visual interpretation of it that so many enjoy is nothing short of monumental IMO.

I think there's plenty of times and places in Middle Earth to set adventures really, even if I'd never run the Ring Mission. (Just as FR's Avatar Crisis.)

I always thought SW was the worse offender though, too many Jedi and the timelines were always too strict, Old Republic maybe, but... eh.

That, and any self-respecting D&D player would have finished off Shelob and raided her lair, then looted Frodo's "corpse".

Just saying is all.

I'm sure most would have died attacking the tower, rather than taking Shelob's "safer course".

If the NPC (Gollum) suggests a path that doesn't result in XP, when there's a big keep full of wandering monsters, the players go straight.

Halfway through the place, they'd be looking for a place to camp for 12 hours though.

 

[Gentlegamer]

A flight of eagles was there to save the dwarves in The Hobbit, and one saved Gandalf from Saruman. They were an underutilized resource.

Each time the great eagles appeared, it was on their own initiative. They aren't pokemounts to be summoned at need.

 

[GwydapLlew]

That, and any self-respecting D&D player would have finished off Shelob and raided her lair, then looted Frodo's "corpse".

Just saying is all.

Well, after the DM allowed his best friend's PC to come back from the dead by having the PC's cohort roll a natural 20 with the +3 mithril verminbane shortsword, it would hardly be fair to have that cohort take all the PCs stuff!

Unless, of course, the DM was letting the player portray the cohort until he could retcon the PC death. After all, it was an epic-level monster and these were only 5th level characters (with NPC levels to boot!)

 

[William drake]

*sigh*

No one ever says anything to Men about their stupid habit of up and dying either. I can see it now, Elrond turns to the men and says, "Just when Middle Earth needs you, you are going to grow old, die, and flee outside the walls of the world. What a goldbricker. What a lazy selfish peice of trash you are. Show some concern for a change."



So, you are suggesting that Elrond should have killed his best friend's son and taken the ring from him? Yeah, that would have worked really well. "Give me the ring, Isildur.... It's precious to me. It's my birthday." *gollum*

Sheesh, folks. If you don't get it, its a freakin' major artifact. It's more powerful (relatively) than most D&D gods. You don't mess with it.

No, what I was saying that the Elves never got any word about how they were just leaving, abandoning the world. Only in the movie was it brought up, when Gladriel mentaly messaged Elrond and asked him if they would just leave men to their Fate. I dont seem a bunch of middeleage men, who were prob racests to elves and other races, not saying anything to Legolas about how his people, the wisest of them all, were just leaving when things were getting bad.

And what I said about Elrond, maches with hisown regret... that he should have killed Isildur, or made him, in whatever shape that had to have come, for the good of what needed to be done. No, he wouldn't have taken it for himself, he would have been wise enough to know that he couldn't let his friend walk out with it. He would have been a true wise leader, he would have put aside hisown ties to Isildur for the good of MIDDLE EARTH.

I hate to go to Star Wars, but its the way that Obe Wan faught Aniken: he knew he was a sith, and he knew he couldn't let him go. He did it because that was his job, and to allow Aniken to live was something that couldn't be allowed. However, he didn't finish the job, but thought it was over considering how injured Aniken was...and he didnt know that the Emperor was on his way to save him, or I think, Obe Wan would have finished the job.

 

[Numion]

The Eagles were not a resource, they were a race of creatures with their own thoughts and part of it was to stay out of the wars of Men and Elves as much as they could. They were not things to be summoned or a resource to be utilized. They only showed up the few times they did based on their assessment of the need and decision by them to assist Gandalf and his people.

If Gandalf had broached the idea of flying into Mordor early on he would have been rebuffed and they would not have had the help of Eagles ever again.

... and Hobbits are a race that would never have anything to do with adventures

Just saying, stereotypes aren't really strong in Tolkiens works. Hobbits supposedly don't adventure, but then slay a dragon and beat the ring. Elves and dwarves can't be friends - what happens to Gimli and Legolas? Eagles don't want to help - they save the day in every book.

 

[Hussar]

Just a thought about the eagles getting to Mount Doom.

They can. We know they can. We know for an absolute, incontrovertible fact that they can. We know this, because they did it. They must have started into Mordor some time before the destruction of the Ring or Frodo and Samwise would have been toasted hobbits. There were no defenses, no aerial battles, nothing. At least as far as we know.

The eagles made it all the way to Mt Doom in time to pick up Frodo and his boyfriend.